Small schools

[oldschool2]

I can see your premise,  Someone at a larger school may have more competitors for a position on a team than at a smaller school.  However, I am not willing to take the leap that it causes an athlete at a smaller school not to have to compete as hard.

Agree to disagree. 

[RETIREDFAN1]

They never do.  The truth bothers most people.  Especially now a days....the generation of people who get offended by literally everything.

Your OPINION is far from truth..........

[oldschool2]

Your OPINION is far from truth..........

My opinion is that small school kids don't learn to compete because they aren't forced to..because of numbers.

The opinion part is truthfully my opinion.  The reason I have the opinion is the truth.  There are fewer kids...hence less people to compete with for academic/athletic gains.  Truth.

[Whoa]

remember WOSgrad not all districts have Valedictorians.  PNG has top 2%, 5%, etc...

 

No way a small school can measure up academically, athletically and facility wise.  Do most kids enjoy their small school stuff YES because you can be a big fish in a little pond.  ship a Warren kid to Katy, Allen and see what happens to most, not all. And at a small school the politics are unreal!!  I have taught in a small district and large.  both enjoyable but different. 

[AggiesAreWe]

Well if oldschool's opinion can be truth, can't my opinion be truth?

[RETIREDFAN1]

 

My opinion is that small school kids don't learn to compete because they aren't forced to..because of numbers.

The opinion part is truthfully my opinion.  The reason I have the opinion is the truth.  There are fewer kids...hence less people to compete with for academic/athletic gains.  Truth.

 

People who believe their OPINION is truth are often delusional in many other aspects of their lives as well......you OPINION is nothing but that.....you have shown absolutely ZERO quantifiable data to back it up, so I'm left to form my OPINION that yours is total BS.......

Edited September 17, 2015 by Colmesneilfan1

[Javelina]

How do ya'll think the newly formed high school would do in their new districts since this thread is based on sports

9-4A Divison 2

Hamshire-Fannett

Liberty

Orangefield

Hardin-Jefferson

West Orange-Stark

Spurgyville (Spurger-Kirbyville)

North Newton County (Brookland-Burkeville-Newton)

South Jasper County (Buna-Evadale)

Hardin-Liberty (Hull-Daisetta-Hardin-West Hardin)

 

10-4A Division 1

Bridge City

Cleveland

Huffman Hargrave

Jasper

Splendora

Chambers County (EC-Anahuac-High Island)

Tyler County (Woodville-Warren-Colmesneil-Chester)

 

22-5A

Beaumont Central

Beaumont Ozen

Lumberton

Nederland

Port Neches-Groves

Vidor

Hardin County (Silsbee-Kountze)

LC-M-D (LC-M-Deweyville)

I think Sabine Pass merging with PAM would not make a big impact in 6A

Edited September 17, 2015 by Javelina

[warparty]

Small school kids have more opportunities to be competitive by being able to compete in more things.  Also helps in being more well rounded. If you are a good athlete, you will rise to the top no matter what you are doing.

[WOSgrad]

remember WOSgrad not all districts have Valedictorians.  PNG has top 2%, 5%, etc...

 

No way a small school can measure up academically, athletically and facility wise.  Do most kids enjoy their small school stuff YES because you can be a big fish in a little pond.  ship a Warren kid to Katy, Allen and see what happens to most, not all. And at a small school the politics are unreal!!  I have taught in a small district and large.  both enjoyable but different. 

Again, I am not willing to take the leap that more is better every time. 

And as to large degree of school politics, I don't know that we live in an area that would be able to contend that is limited to small school districts.

[oldschool2]

Well if oldschool's opinion can be truth, can't my opinion be truth?

I didn't say my opinion was truth..  I said my opinion was truthfully my opinion.  The FACT that small school kids have less people pushing them for competition is the FACT that causes my OPINION that they don't learn to compete.

Are you saying that kids in smaller schools have fewer kids pushing them for spots?  Because that is not opinion.. that's math.

[Whoa]

You will rise to the top.

problem is the top is much shorter at little schools.

[Hagar]

My opinion is that small school kids don't learn to compete because they aren't forced to..because of numbers.

The opinion part is truthfully my opinion.  The reason I have the opinion is the truth.  There are fewer kids...hence less people to compete with for academic/athletic gains.  Truth.

I guess this is where we differ.  You're saying Joe doesn't learn to compete at Evadale because he has his position all sewed up.  I'm saying Joe learns to compete in each game he plays.  Combine Buna and Evadale, and it's very possible Joe won't play at all.  Then Joe sure won't learn anything about competition.  On a percentage basis, I guarantee kids at Evadale "learn more about competition" than at West Brook   No contest, hands down!

As you said above, we'll agree to disagree.  

[oldschool2]

I guess this is where we differ.  You're saying Joe doesn't learn to compete at Evadale because he has his position all sewed up.  I'm saying Joe learns to compete in each game he plays.  Combine Buna and Evadale, and it's very possible Joe won't play at all.  Then Joe sure won't learn anything about competition.  On a percentage basis, I guarantee kids at Evadale "learn more about competition" than at West Brook   No contest, hands down!

As you said above, we'll agree to disagree.  

From the way I hear it, Joe is probably from Buna anyways. Haha

No but seriously...I'm not sure "Joe" and the other boys at Evadale are quite learning the same level of competition.  If Joe is a decent baseball player he probably doesn't have to make the team at Evadale.  He may have to earn a spot THERE because they have a decent baseball program.  However..Joe will never get any better playing at Evadale once they've established he's on the team because they play against Spurger, Leggett, West Hardin, Hull Daisetta, High Island...and whoever else.  The only taste of competition Joe sees is when they play Big Sandy...the other decent 1A team in the area.  So yeah...

agree to disagree

[Hagar]

From the way I hear it, Joe is probably from Buna anyways. Haha

No but seriously...I'm not sure "Joe" and the other boys at Evadale are quite learning the same level of competition.  If Joe is a decent baseball player he probably doesn't have to make the team at Evadale.  He may have to earn a spot THERE because they have a decent baseball program.  However..Joe will never get any better playing at Evadale once they've established he's on the team because they play against Spurger, Leggett, West Hardin, Hull Daisetta, High Island...and whoever else.  The only taste of competition Joe sees is when they play Big Sandy...the other decent 1A team in the area.  So yeah...

agree to disagree

I think we do agree on one thing.  For whatever reason, there's very few 2A programs in this area that seem to emphasize athletes like Evadale does.  If Evadale put up a banner every time they won Dist in something, the Gym would be full. I'd love to see BS have football, or Legacy join UIL (not sure of their numbers).  Girls last year in Vball did not lose a set in Dist - that's not right. And then they add Iola & Normagee and they end up 1& 2 in Fball and probably again this year.  And you have to get a passport to go there.  

And we ain't letting Joe go back to Buna lol

[Football 101]

From the way I hear it, Joe is probably from Buna anyways. Haha

No but seriously...I'm not sure "Joe" and the other boys at Evadale are quite learning the same level of competition.  If Joe is a decent baseball player he probably doesn't have to make the team at Evadale.  He may have to earn a spot THERE because they have a decent baseball program.  However..Joe will never get any better playing at Evadale once they've established he's on the team because they play against Spurger, Leggett, West Hardin, Hull Daisetta, High Island...and whoever else.  The only taste of competition Joe sees is when they play Big Sandy...the other decent 1A team in the area.  So yeah...

agree to disagree

OK....here we go again It doesn't matter if smaller school districts don't have all the schools like big schools that are competitve when you have a small kid player who plays in the premier baseball league at showcases put on by Rice, Perfect Game in Georgia and TCU which is where my small school "joe player " will be showcasing this weekend and competing against players from the Dallas/Fort Worth area which are 5A/6A which he has been doing for a while. I promise you he could leave our small school and go play on any 4A or 5A school in baseball he wants , I know this because he gets ask quite to move to a bigger school, but no point when the scouts don't come to the high schools anymore. We are going and Competing on a much higher level against the best of the best! So there again your opinion is yours, but shows you don't have clue when you think all small school players aren't competing against better bigger players. Just because they don't see it in their districts doesn't mean they aren't getting it somewhere else! This is 2015!!!! More opportunities out there!

[oldschool2]

They don't emphasize athletes like Evadale does because they do it right. For starters...perfectly located close to Buna, Lumberton, and Silsbee.  So they get great transfers..but they're selective. Like every other successful small school in existence. Only allow certain transfers and you control your population. Kudos for that.

And PD126...you honestly think I wouldn't know about the select ranks of...ALL sports.  Several of my buddies that played college ball with me coach in the college ranks.  We talk..often.  I know better competition is available.

But tell me this...what's the % of 3A and down high school athletes are out there seeking better completion? Well..it's low.  And the smaller the school gets..the smaller the %.

MOST small school kids only see what their high school team sees.

[Football 101]

Well I don't know about the rest but mine will see bigger and better competition than the others, guess I'm alot more competive as is my son! My point I'm trying to get across is we see more competive players then what is in our district in other places!

 

[Hagar]

Evadale does get an occasional boy transfer, but hardly ever a girl, and our girls dominate more than the boys.  Why?   Because they work their butts off.  They are forever running up and down the gym, doing pull-ups and push-ups. According to the girls, they work out harder than the football team lol. 

[RaiderRed30]

All I'm gonna say today is that I went to multiple schools. One was as small as 30. The largest had 300 students in the grade. I was top of the class at all of them. The best school was the school with 30 because the teachers were able to learn about and care about the students they had. It made classes easier because you knew the people not just the name.

As for competition, where I'm from the small school students are more competitive in everything. We take that lesson to life because of people like you. We know that we have to fight for everything and nothing is earned. We are the schools with that the entire town rally around on Friday nights. We are the ones who would die on the field for not just our teammates or our family. We would die on the field for the community. We hate placing 2nd in UIL Academic events. That's heart and fight, two skills that are needed to survive in real life.

In College I still strive to be the best to prove who I am. Nothing is for granted. I learned that from a small town, not a large school. Would it make financial sense to consolidate? Yes, but we are talking about what are best for students our future. You mention life skills, well small schools teach that more than anywhere else.

Finally consolidation would mean the end of 6-man. Who wants that?

[PlayActionPass]

What you don't realize is that in most places kids don't compete, they quit. That's why you see numbers down in most programs. If they can't start then they go find something else to do. The small school offers opportunities to kids that otherwise would be sitting at home play flip the bean.

[AggiesAreWe]

I didn't say my opinion was truth..  I said my opinion was truthfully my opinion.  The FACT that small school kids have less people pushing them for competition is the FACT that causes my OPINION that they don't learn to compete.

Are you saying that kids in smaller schools have fewer kids pushing them for spots?  Because that is not opinion.. that's math.

You stated that the truth hurts following an opinion. That is suggesting that what you speak is truth.

[pinelandflash]

More positive thoughts from oldschool2, I see. Ever thought about being a motivational speaker? You can't waste all that positive energy, you know......

[pinelandflash]

They don't emphasize athletes like Evadale does because they do it right. For starters...perfectly located close to Buna, Lumberton, and Silsbee.  So they get great transfers..but they're selective. Like every other successful small school in existence. Only allow certain transfers and you control your population. Kudos for that.

And PD126...you honestly think I wouldn't know about the select ranks of...ALL sports.  Several of my buddies that played college ball with me coach in the college ranks.  We talk..often.  I know better competition is available.

But tell me this...what's the % of 3A and down high school athletes are out there seeking better completion? Well..it's low.  And the smaller the school gets..the smaller the %.

MOST small school kids only see what their high school team sees.

West Sabine has four players off their last three teams now playing college ball, with one being a starting safety at Northwestern State (Desmond Lacey) ,two others starting at Kilgore JC (Reshod Williams) and at Sul Ross University (Kirkland Wilson), and one red shirting at SFA (Hunter Cabral). Not bad for a little bitty 2A school......

[LCMAlumtiger32]

How do ya'll think the newly formed high school would do in their new districts since this thread is based on sports

9-4A Divison 2

Hamshire-Fannett

Liberty

Orangefield

Hardin-Jefferson

West Orange-Stark

Spurgyville (Spurger-Kirbyville)

North Newton County (Brookland-Burkeville-Newton)

South Jasper County (Buna-Evadale)

Hardin-Liberty (Hull-Daisetta-Hardin-West Hardin)

 

10-4A Division 1

Bridge City

Cleveland

Huffman Hargrave

Jasper

Splendora

Chambers County (EC-Anahuac-High Island)

Tyler County (Woodville-Warren-Colmesneil-Chester)

 

22-5A

Beaumont Central

Beaumont Ozen

Lumberton

Nederland

Port Neches-Groves

Vidor

Hardin County (Silsbee-Kountze)

LC-M-D (LC-M-Deweyville)

I think Sabine Pass merging with PAM would not make a big impact in 6A

I Would imagine LCM and WOS would combine before LCM and Deweyville would. But this probably won't ever  happen anyways. But Deweyville would have a longer drive to Newton or Buna so you might have to merge all three. 

[Chester86]

This is really making me laugh.  You guys are making it sound like I want every school to be a big school.  Like 1000-4000 kids.  I never said that, nor meant/applied that.  I SAID 500 minimum.  The difference in 150 and 500 would be astronomical.  Literally the difference in exerting a little bit more effort to remain in the top 10..or having to worry about maybe losing your starting spot.  I don't understand what would be wrong with that.  I guess it doesn't matter.  

MY OPINION is that small schools (very small schools) ruin kids chances of learning to be competitive.  In every aspect of life.

   I graduated from Chester HS in 1986, with a class of 19.  In my class alone we now have a chemical engineer, a college dean of financial aid, a director of education for a prison, a law-enforcement supervisor, several private business owners, a registered nurse, a banker, a high-ranking oil-field supervisor, a school employee and an upper-level non-commissioned officer in the military.  Those are just the ones off the top of my head, as I have lost contact with several class members, and we have had a few pass away.

    Economically you would kill smaller communities.  Most small communities have the school district as the largest employer.  You truly want to consolidate, you are not going to have campuses in those communities - not cost effective.  So you have lost your largest employer, your taxes go to another community and you lose jobs, tax money, business opportunities.  Business opportunities?  Take your local restaurant in town, and you have your tournament or games in general.  You are going to make the bulk of your money off these opportunities of people coming to your community.  

    School pride!  Has Beaumont ever recovered from consolidating?  Beaumont used to have school pride, and community pride.  French High, Beaumont High, Charlton-Pollard High, Hebert High, Forrest Park High, South Park High....community pride was abundant.  It was decided to consolidate, and Beaumont lost something it has never gotten back.

    I am not angry at you.  Discussion is good, and not everyone has to agree with each other.  You will probably not agree with my assessment, and find fault in many of my arguments.  I was raised in Beaumont, and moved to Chester my freshman year.  I was able to play football, basketball, baseball, tennis and participate in numerous UIL events.  I would have never had those opportunities had we stayed in Beaumont.  I will end with this.  I was in Arkansas this past weekend at a HS baseball prospect camp with my son at a university up there.  I was talking to one of the dads from Arkansas, and he mentioned this very thing you are proposing.  He went on to say how horrible it has been for the smaller communities.  The city/community where the HS was located gets the preferential treatment.  The kids that were brought in from the outlying communities were treated as second class, and made to feel inferior.  I chuckled when you posted this thread, thinking about that conversation.  We will stay at our small school, and I went from purple and gold to the Blue and Gold of Evadale HS supporting my boys.