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Bob West says Pat Knight is leading candidate.

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UNLV

UNLV

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Posted
I rarely agree, if ever, with Bob West but he is right on this "For those who roll their eyes when Abatemarco is mentioned, Lamar could do much worse.  He’s easily the best basketball tactician and in-game strategist to sit at the end of the LU bench since Pat Foster, and that was 20 plus years ago when he was young and immature."
Abatemarco is the best X and O guy on the Lamar list...End of Story. Abatemarco can out recruit Roc.

However his negative is his mouth. He reminds me of Mike Tyson or Ali. with the mouth. Great talent but runs off at the mouth.
In a interviewed done a few years ago, you can  see he has humbled up. But I think he can still rub many the wrong way.

Cross would be a good coach too. Abatemarco and Cross would produce first year good results because Lamar already has the talent, experience, and style that fits Abatemarco and Cross style.

I am worried but willing to give the benefit to a Sutton or Knight or Evans.

I still say no to Brooks.
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coachacola

coachacola

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Posted
Tom Abatemarco's coaching record:

[tt]Team Years Record
Sac State    1997-2000 13-66 (0.165)
Drake        1988-1990 23-29 (0.442)
Lamar        1986-1988 34-26 (0.567)

Overall:  3 teams, 7 seasons, 70-121 (0.366)[/tt]

http://statsheet.com/mcb/coaches/tom-abatemarco/career_record

Pat Knight's coaching record:

[tt]Team Years Record
Texas Tech 2007-2011 62-69 (0.473)

Overall:  1 team, 4 seasons, 62-69 (0.473)[/tt]

http://statsheet.com/mcb/coaches/pat-knight

Alvin Brook's coaching record:

[tt]Team Years Record
Houston 1993-1998 54-84 (0.391)

Overall:  1 team, 5 seasons, 54-84 (0.391)[/tt]

http://statsheet.com/mcb/coaches/alvin-brooks

Terry Evans' coaching record:

[quote]Evans is 193-80 in nine years at UCO -- including a 104-23 mark the last four seasons -- and has directed the Bronchos to seven national tournament appearances, including the last four in a row.  He also led the team to six Lone Star Conference North Division titles and two overall league crowns.[/quote]

http://www.bronchosports.com/coaches.aspx?rc=13

That's a .706 winning percentage.  The big difference is that he's been winning at the D2 level.  But I prefer someone who's proven he can win at the lower levels than someone who's proven he CANNOT win at the highest level.
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Bruce

Bruce

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I'm sorry, I just don't get it.  I see the appeal of Sutton (as well as the risk).  I see the appeal of Knight, if you believe he was in over his head too soon at Tech.  I can see the appeal of Evans, Cross, or Skelton given their successes at lower levels of hoops.

I still think Brooks is on these lists as a courtesy given his previous ties to LU: 54-84 at the U of H isn't what we're looking for.  But I understand why the media and other folks mention his name.

Why is Abatemarco even being mentioned?  Ever?  Comedy?  Irony?  The guy has had three coaching jobs.  After leaving Lamar, he was fired from Drake for abusing players having essentially spawned a mutiny.  He went 13-66 at Sacramento State, although I'm not sure anyone could win there.  He's had no success as a head coach at the college level, clearly has a habit of being abrasive to players and the community (and, mind you, I wasn't even living in the area when whatever-it-was went down with Abatemarco and the local community--actually, I'm curious as to exactly what it was that happened if one of you old-timers knows :)). 

Frankly, I just don't get it.  I understand if folks say he's a good X's-and-O's tactician, but when you've got a reputation as being that big of a jerk, it's clear that he can't recruit good enough players for his programs to be competitive on a consistent basis.  He's a born assistant.  We just got rid of a guy who fit that profile perfectly.  What could possibly possess us to do that again?  Don't get me wrong, one of the "prime candidates" might end up not being the answer, either, but at least they are truly unknowns.  Abatemarco, like Brooks, is a proven failure.  You could say Knight is as well, but there's a hell of a difference between failing in the Big XII at a young age versus doing so at programs like UH or Drake. 

I'm still not sure who my favorite candidate is at this point--I'm leaning a bit to Evans at this point, but think Sutton deserves a second chance if he's interested, and I can't imagine Knight couldn't coach at this level.  I just think Cross is too young, but I wouldn't be upset if he got the shot; I'd absolutely love it if he became an assistant--especially if one of the bigger names takes the job who we all know might look to jump ship in a few years if they're successful.
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WOSgrad

WOSgrad

Posted
Posted
[quote name="Bruce" post="989036" timestamp="1301260732"]
I'm sorry, I just don't get it.  I see the appeal of Sutton (as well as the risk).  I see the appeal of Knight, if you believe he was in over his head too soon at Tech.  I can see the appeal of Evans, Cross, or Skelton given their successes at lower levels of hoops.

I still think Brooks is on these lists as a courtesy given his previous ties to LU: 54-84 at the U of H isn't what we're looking for.  But I understand why the media and other folks mention his name.

Why is Abatemarco even being mentioned?  Ever?  Comedy?  Irony?  The guy has had three coaching jobs.  After leaving Lamar, he was fired from Drake for abusing players having essentially spawned a mutiny.  He went 13-66 at Sacramento State, although I'm not sure anyone could win there.  He's had no success as a head coach at the college level, clearly has a habit of being abrasive to players and the community (and, mind you, I wasn't even living in the area when whatever-it-was went down with Abatemarco and the local community--actually, I'm curious as to exactly what it was that happened if one of you old-timers knows :)). 

Frankly, I just don't get it.  I understand if folks say he's a good X's-and-O's tactician, but when you've got a reputation as being that big of a jerk, it's clear that he can't recruit good enough players for his programs to be competitive on a consistent basis.  He's a born assistant.  We just got rid of a guy who fit that profile perfectly.  What could possibly possess us to do that again?  Don't get me wrong, one of the "prime candidates" might end up not being the answer, either, but at least they are truly unknowns.  Abatemarco, like Brooks, is a proven failure.  You could say Knight is as well, but there's a heck of a difference between failing in the Big XII at a young age versus doing so at programs like UH or Drake. 

I'm still not sure who my favorite candidate is at this point--I'm leaning a bit to Evans at this point, but think Sutton deserves a second chance if he's interested, and I can't imagine Knight couldn't coach at this level.  I just think Cross is too young, but I wouldn't be upset if he got the shot; I'd absolutely love it if he became an assistant--especially if one of the bigger names takes the job who we all know might look to jump ship in a few years if they're successful.
[/quote]

My man!
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Ruckdad

Ruckdad

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Posted
Like Cruce - I see no need to bring Abatemarco back - for any reason.  To me it comes down to picking the best five finalists and trusting Tidwell and Simmons to make the right hire based on the interviews.  Each of the candidates has question marks.  They have all been good assistants, but some have not had success at higher level institutions, while others have had success but we can't be sure that success would transfer from a lower level.  And finally, there are those who have no HC experiience.

As I have said, my five would be Cross, Knight, Skelton, Green and Evans.  If Sutton can convince Simmons has drug history is exactly that, then maybe he can slide in for a final interview as well.
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UNLV

UNLV

Posted
Posted
The last time Tubbs/Simmons picked the forum favorite, we got Roc.
I say go outside the box of picking the good SAFE guy. You all worry about what others thing so we end up
picking the safe guy instead of the best basketball brain. Lamar didn't choose Floyd because he was nutts and proved it the last 20 years. I honestly believe Abatemarco is nutts enough to get Lamar to the sweet 16. As a Lamar fan, I am tired of losing with the nice safe coach. If you want LU to win this upcoming season, Abatemarco is the guy. I'm not saying the others can't, I don't know. I do know what an Abatemarco can do with the current talent and SLC. Win it all.
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puddin tane

puddin tane

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Posted
They hire Abatemarco  and I will turn my back on LU forever....they can have my tickets and passes and tailgate spots..I'll burn my LU flags..they will never get one cent from me again.......

[b]GO Pokes?...[/b]thats hard, but I can do it if he comes back.......

btw...Bob West is a boob...........
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UNLV

UNLV

Posted
Posted
[quote name="puddin tane" post="989082" timestamp="1301270381"]
They hire Abatemarco  and I will turn my back on LU forever....they can have my tickets and passes and tailgate spots..I'll burn my LU flags..they will never get one cent from me again.......

[b]GO Pokes?...[/b]thats hard, but I can do it if he comes back.......

btw...Bob West is a boob...........
[/quote]What did Abatemarco do that was so bad?
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UNLV

UNLV

Posted
Posted
[quote name="WBbear" post="989087" timestamp="1301271996"]
I don't believe Abatemarco will get enough votes to be the next coach.
[/quote]I wouldn't bet on it either. However I would like the next LU MBB coach to be hired for skills and not because he is popular, fan favorite, safe, or who he knows.
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geezer

geezer

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Posted
The biggest thing Abettamarco did at the time that I am familiar with was he said that Patrizi's was a poor excuse for an Italian resturant.  The other thing was jump ship to what he believed was a stronger basketball conference after only two years.
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UNLV

UNLV

Posted
Posted
[quote name="geezer" post="989111" timestamp="1301275568"]
The biggest thing Abettamarco did at the time that I am familiar with was he said that Patrizi's was a poor excuse for an Italian resturant.  The other thing was jump ship to what he believed was a stronger basketball conference after only two years.
[/quote]I asked  puddin because I believe he didn't know and his opinion was just a follow the crowd.

Abatemarco basically said he didn't like the City of Beaumont because we lacked Italian restaurants. Keep in mind this was long before Dowlen we know today. He was also a bit overbearing. But that's it. His crime of the century; bad mouthing Beaumont.
Let he who has never spoken negative about Beaumont cast the first stone.
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InTheGates

InTheGates

Posted
Posted
The best comment so far in this forum is....

Bob West is a boob.....now that right there is good stuff....

I think a good combination would be bring in Sutton or Knight and tag team it with Cross as an assistant.....If your not wanting the overall "name" thing then Evans would be a guy to really look at...

I am wondering if there are other names that haven't been brought up yet....I think they have  a couple more not mentioned yet that can get the job done....
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UNLV

UNLV

Posted
Posted
[quote name="ForeverADog" post="989161" timestamp="1301296438"]
UNLV, I'm confused on why you think Abetamarco is the right coach? He has proven at multiple stops he is not a good coach at all. He doesn't win. Where does he get this reputation as a great coach?
[/quote]You can't look at record as a coach only. Tubbs was a huge failure in his second stay at Lamar.
Abatemarco was the last coach at Lamar to win 20 games. I remember how excited I was to see his 3rd year.
Abatemarco got ran out of town because of his mouth. He went to Drake and he became a coach that is known for verbally abusing
players, just like Bobby Knight. The difference between Knight and Abatemarco is Knight was tolerated.
Abatemarco went on to coach in many places including the WNBA and NBA. He has grown up and is wiser. At least that is what
I saw in an interview. Cross, Evans, and Skelton look very good on paper. However I am very nervous about them.
I am sick of  losing at Lamar and do not feel like waiting 3-4 years for a new coach to build a program AND on the job
DI training. Lamar should be dominating the SLC. I'm am 99.9 percent sure Abatemarco could in his first year.

You can't say he lack experience.
http://www.cubuffs.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=600&ATCLID=204910523
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BLUEDOVE3

BLUEDOVE3

Posted
Posted
[quote name="UNLV" post="989212" timestamp="1301321253"]
[quote author=ForeverADog link=topic=82332.msg989161#msg989161 date=1301296438]
UNLV, I'm confused on why you think Abetamarco is the right coach? He has proven at multiple stops he is not a good coach at all. He doesn't win. Where does he get this reputation as a great coach?
[/quote]You can't look at record as a coach only. Tubbs was a huge failure in his second stay at Lamar.
Abatemarco was the last coach at Lamar to win 20 games. I remember how excited I was to see his 3rd year.
Abatemarco got ran out of town because of his mouth. He went to Drake and he became a coach that is known for verbally abusing
players, just like Bobby Knight. The difference between Knight and Abatemarco is Knight was tolerated.
Abatemarco went on to coach in many places including the WNBA. He has grown up and is wiser. At least that is what
I saw in an interview. Cross, Evans, and Skelton look very good on paper. However I am very nervous about them.
I am sick of  losing at Lamar and do not feel like waiting 3-4 years for a new coach to build a program AND on the job
DI training. Lamar should be dominating the SLC. I'm am 99.9 percent sure Abatemarco could in his first year.
[/quote]It's that missing 0.1% I'm worried about ;D
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NorthoftheBorder

NorthoftheBorder

Posted
Posted
[quote name="puddin tane" post="989082" timestamp="1301270381"]
They hire Abatemarco  and I will turn my back on LU forever....they can have my tickets and passes and tailgate spots..I'll burn my LU flags..they will never get one cent from me again.......

[b]GO Pokes?...[/b]thats hard, but I can do it if he comes back.......

btw...Bob West is a boob...........
[/quote]

Bob West is not a boob, but I think he is wrong on Abatemarco and I would not support him being hired under any circumstance. I would rather see UNLV as head coach than Abatemoutho if that tells you anything.  And why would you want to take it out on Woodard and the football team because you are pissed at Dr. Simmons over the basketball hire?  That doesn't make sense puddin.
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WOSgrad

WOSgrad

Posted
Posted
[quote name="UNLV" post="989212" timestamp="1301321253"]
You can't look at record as a coach only[/quote]

Yes, you can.  You can talk about X's and O's, you can talk about recruiting, but ultimately, it is whether a coach wins, which is something documented by your own words below.

[quote author=UNLV link=topic=82332.msg989212#msg989212 date=1301321253]
Tubbs was a huge failure in his second stay at Lamar. Abatemarco was the last coach at Lamar to win 20 games.
[/quote]

All the more reason not to bring back Abatemarco back.  Tubbs actually built a winner at Lamar, at Oklahoma. That 20 win season at Lamar is the only season Abatemarco has had a winning record as a head coach at 3 different stops, why bring back a losing coach?  Abatemarco couldn't recruit well enough or do enough x's and o's to keep Lamar above .500 and he had some players left from Foster's stay.  I like you, UNLV, I think you are a smart person, but I think you are overrating Abatemarco's skills.

[quote author=UNLV link=topic=82332.msg989212#msg989212 date=1301321253]
I remember how excited I was to see his 3rd year.
[/quote]

I think you might have been the only one.

[quote author=UNLV link=topic=82332.msg989212#msg989212 date=1301321253]
Abatemarco got ran out of town because of his mouth. He went to Drake and he became a coach that is known for verbally abusing players, just like Bobby Knight. The difference between Knight and Abatemarco is Knight was tolerated.
[/quote]

You are absolutely correct that Knight got away with things that Abatemarco (and many others) could not get away with.  And you know why that is?  Because Knight won basketball games and consistently lead his teams to Big 10 championships and NCAA title appearances!  As dumb as the comments were that he made about Beaumont, had Abatemarco repeated the 20 win season at Lamar, I am quite sure that Billy Franklin, the buffoon that he was, would have found a way to keep him at Lamar.

For Abatemarco to be considered amongst the top candidates leads me to believe that Lamar needs to KEEP LOOKING.
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