Mr. Houston Hoops Jim Hicks gives his opinion on the Yates game

[HoopInsider_Cooper]

F YOU DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT YATES BASKETBALL BEFORE, YOU DO NOW!

By: Jim Hicks (RCS Sports.com)

Houston Jack Yates (the country's #1 ranked public school) found themselves the subject of controversy after Tuesday’s 170-35 record setting win over Houston Lee.  Not since 1992 (Hardin Jefferson HS) have a team scored this many points during a regulation high school game.  Ironically, that East Texas based team was coached by current UIL director Charles Breithaupt.  I don’t know about you, but I don’t recall this much (ahem) backlash, criticizing, antagonizing, etc. eighteen years ago.  But that’s really not the point I want to hammer. 

Head coach Greg Wise is not a rookie to success.  He has been to the state tournament three of the past four years which he’s been a head coach (Hightower HS 2002, 2003, and Yates HS 2009).  His winning percentage over the past decade is more solid than any active 5A coach in the area (who is not named Ronnie Courtney or Royce Huseman).  Not to mention the fact that as a parent, he is the nations only high school coach with two sons (non twins) currently playing division one basketball for the same school.  Therefore, on paper, it’s safe to say that he’s done well in the fatherhood category as well.  No, I ain’t his lawyer, publicist, or nothing like that.  In a span of 24 hours, he’s been flat out hammered over the airwaves regarding the outcome of Monday afternoon’s game.

BUY THE RUMOR, SELL THE FACT!
Weeks prior to the season opener, Wise publicly stated the Lions would basically flex their muscles against every single opponent on schedule.  That “unofficial disclaimer” must have been ignored or dismissed as tea steam.  C’mon now, this team was fresh off a dominating state title run captivated by handing Dallas Kimball their worse loss of the season.  Truth be told, I’m a sports fan who just happen to get paid for my analysis.  Understand one thing - this Yates team is really and truly just “that good”.  This isn’t one of those cases where a bully is picking on some helpless kid for his lunch money.  Don’t get it twisted.  The Lions have also hemmed up the very teams that over half dozen states view as bullies within their borders.  Case in point, over the holidays, Yates beat up on some of the prized possessions representing the states of Hawaii, Georgia, California, Pennsylvania, Washington, and Alabama.  Still, some of the local media personalities must have seriously ignored the national headlines, press memos, and of course the updates on Rcs Sports.com.    If not, then why has the fact that Yates scored 170 or beat an opponent like Houston Lee HS by 135 points been presented as such shocking news?  Did you not get the hint during the first week of the season after Yates beat Sam Houston (which featured a nationally Top 100 player) 163-71.  A couple weeks later their victim was Kashmere HS, 146-47.  One of the main reasons they didn’t reach 170 points in either of those games is simply because the clock expired.  Sometimes what we actually do is not as great as what we are expected to do.  In economics there’s a long standing proverb – “Buy the rumor, sell the fact”.  In this case, maybe folk didn’t exactly ignore the potency of Yates, but perhaps they didn’t take this high school team seriously.  Within the past 24 hours countless media outlets, radio talk shows, and barber shops became the platform for many hoop fans to express their views and opinions while casually pointing blame where they deemed most convenient.  Just think of your favorite college football or baseball team, and imagine what would happen if they went head to head against one of the absolute worse programs?  In baseball, a mercy rule prevents scores from getting astronomical.  Basketball in the state of Texas does not possess a limit on how many points a team may score, or the margin of victory.  However, I feel optimistic that such a rule may be incorporated into legislation in the near future.

I DON’T AGREE, BUT ATLEAST I DO UNDERSTAND!
Let’s get one thing straight, I personally don’t necessarily agree with smacking a team by 135, but I do understand many of the intangibles that went into Wise’s logic for proceeding with his attack.    They basically have one gear, and the manner of which they substitute is far different from what you might think.  Very seldom will you see five in for five out.  Instead, there may be three subs here, next dead ball – two more.  Two dead balls later, four more would be inserted, and so forth.  This team has long been programmed to attack like Vick’s old pits.  The last two times Wise instructed his players to mash on the breaks, they found themselves on the short end of a devastating and embarrassing losses at the hands of Wheatley HS (March 2008) and Alief Elsik HS (Dec 2008).  Make no mistake about it – Yates players and coaches watch the news, listen to talk radio, and read the internet.  You can rest assured they heard many of your piercing complaints and belittling accusations regarding the blame.

Man, that Wise don’t know what he’s doing!
What da heck was he thinking?
He’ll never win the big one!
That’s what they get, for running up the score!
See there… I told you they should’ve hired (insert your favorite coach here) at first?

If you thought or said it, don’t lie to yourself.  Go ahead admit it, none of us can hear or see you smiling on the other side of your computer screen.

DON’T ACT LIKE YOU FORGOT!
The first string of national milestones occurred during the Thanksgiving holidays of 2007 when Yates shocked West Monroe HS from Louisiana.  That team featured then #1 player in the country Greg Monroe (currently at Georgetown).    A month later at the “Houston vs. The Nation”, Yates became the first public school to beat the nation’s #1 and #2 teams during the same weekend.  I remember it like yesterday, and will do my best to not allow you to forget.  Two of the nation’s most respected and heralded basketball programs, Oak Hill (VA) and St Patrick’s (NJ) both left Houston that year wondering as if they’d been ambushed. 

Fast forward into January 2010, a counter productive experience resulted from the combination of Yates being so prepared with Lee HS being so unprepared.  After leading 100-12 at the half, the Lions started the second half with a few quick baskets to extend the lead to a “yard”.  Moments later, as one of the Yates player went up for a dunk, a defender created a harder than expected foul.  Tempers flared, benches cleared, and smack was exchanged.  Although it’s rather unusual for the amount of participants, not a single punch was thrown.  With that being said, I’ve been scratching my head trying to figure out why and how did this episode turn into a bench clearing brawl?

FACT VERSUS FICTION!
Most of the Houston area outlets who helped release this story presented it with a splash of false negativity which insinuated the Yates players to be a bit on the thuggish side.  Most of the time, media will write or say something that their primary audience wants to hear.  I totally understand how that game is played.  But in this particular game, there was no fight whatsoever.  The Houston Independent School District athletic director has confirmed that no reprimands have been handed down to either coach, but he will speak with both teams on Thursday afternoon in regards to sportsmanship.
After the halt in action, a 20 minute meeting was held between coaches, officials, and a HISD administrator which was on site.  A decision was made that since both benches emptied onto the court, those players in violation would be suspended for the remainder of the game.  Lee HS coach wanted to simply pack up and forfeit the rest of the game, but what is a coach to do if your players look you square in the eye and tell you they want to play the game?  Any coach would have been less than man had he not granted his team a simple request to prove they aren’t quitters.  Therefore, the game was resumed with both team’s starters and no bench players to substitute.  From my understanding, although they did play mostly man to man defense, Yates did not apply their normal dose of aggressive full court pressure because their lone five players would have possibly collapsed on the court in attempt to do so.  Also, another stipulation was implemented by the referees – the first player from either team to foul out (5 fouls) will result in the ending of the game.  Obviously, if Lee players had grown tired of the demolition derby, they could have easily created five consecutive fouls and that wouldn’t have been a wrap.  In the light of things, I respect the act of courage from the entire Lee HS team.  In this different time and era, often we grown ups under estimate the mindset of our youth, especially 16-18 year olds.  These guys are much stronger than most of us have given them credit for.  If some of these same young men committed a felony crime tomorrow, they would most likely be tried in adult criminal court.  On the flipside, there’s plenty of life lessons that can be attained from this 170-35 experience, even for the thousands of fans who have jack knifed themselves into this great debate of blame assessment.  As a matter of fact, I just locked into my Blackberry calendar for the date, June 2020.  That should be the month of the ten year class reunion for the seniors on both teams.  If I’m able to see the day, I hope to attend and personally witness to what extent this historic occurrence had on any of these players during their evolvement from young boys to men. 

[shorttexas1]

Jim always has the right thing to say!

[team first]

yea i really love the part where he say "yates being so prepared, and lee being so unprepared". (Really) Like that had anything to do with it. Dam, only if lee would have prepared a little more.

[AggiesAreWe]

Again, why press when you are up by 100?

Just another spin. ::)

[bullets13]

"The last two times Wise instructed his players to mash on the breaks, they found themselves on the short end of a devastating and embarrassing losses at the hands of Wheatley HS (March 2008) and Alief Elsik HS (Dec 2008)."


Well, it's a good thing they kept their foot on the gas.  i'm quite sure had they stopped pressing Lee would've overcome their [b][size=18pt]88[/size][/b] point halftime deficit.

[iknoweverthing2]

what chu mean why press wen youre up by 100????? if youre good youre good.. thats the problem wit teams from this area they always worry bout other teams feelings. the job is to win at all cost and let players play basketball. if u cant hang wit yates dont put them on the schedule. these guys can win state in all divisions 1a,2a,3a,4a,5a, maybe even nba hahahahahahahahahahahah lol lol lol

[Lazeek]

Someone said that 60-70 point games just happen but winning by 100 doesn't.  Really?  What's the difference between winning by 70 and winning by 100?  And what does it matter how you got to that point?  Yates would have beaten Lee by 70 without pressing.  Splitting hairs if you ask me.

[AggiesAreWe]

C'mon LAZEEK, 135 point wins don't just happen. Those kind of wins are forced.

I can respect a 70 point win by Yates after calling off the press much more than a 135 point win and pressing the enitre game.

It was just totally unnecessary.

Difference between a 70 point win without pressing and 135 point win pressing the whole game, is class and respect.

[shorttexas1]

You guys talk like Yates recuits!  They have the same opportunity to get kids as good as they have or as bad as Lee has.  The playing fields are level, they both play by UIL rules, and they both suit up to COMPETE!!! WIN or LOSE!

[AggiesAreWe]

[quote name="shorttexas1" post="740003" timestamp="1262895231"]
[b]You guys talk like Yates recuits![/b]  They have the same opportunity to get kids as good as they have or as bad as Lee has.  The playing fields are level, they both play by UIL rules, and they both suit up to COMPETE!!! WIN or LOSE!
[/quote]

Where did anyone in this thread say or even suggest that Yates recruits?

[homeless]

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="740006" timestamp="1262895393"]
[quote author=shorttexas1 link=topic=64474.msg740003#msg740003 date=1262895231]
[b]You guys talk like Yates recuits![/b]  They have the same opportunity to get kids as good as they have or as bad as Lee has.  The playing fields are level, they both play by UIL rules, and they both suit up to COMPETE!!! WIN or LOSE!
[/quote]

Where did anyone in this thread say or even suggest that Yates recruits?
[/quote]

Not sure anyone said it, but I will: they recruit. So what?

[homeless]

I've got some some major differences with Hicks on some subjects, but here he's exactly correct.

[BLUEDOVE3]

What a classless act by Alabama tonight. They didn't have to  score that last touchdown with only a few seconds left in the game. It was already won.

[AggiesAreWe]

Yep

[Kountzer]

Jim Hicks is an AAU pimp.

[team first]

Yep Dove, Not necessary, but there is a difference, it was one time... Yates continues to do it..record, who cares about that..Nobody...just win , go undefeated, win back to back and do it right. 16pts is not what I would call an embarassment...135 pts is a little different. Until you've been in a situation where someone does not pull the dogs off, YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND...it is plain unsportsman-like and classless..hes filling his ego, but not smart enough to understand that it's not his coaching that makes them good...My sister could win big with that group, and she thinks the offense stays on one end, and the defense stays on the other, like backin the day.

[backdoorcuts]

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="739947" timestamp="1262891686"]
C'mon LAZEEK, 135 point wins don't just happen. Those kind of wins are forced.

I can respect a 70 point win by Yates after calling off the press much more than a 135 point win and pressing the enitre game.

It was just totally unnecessary.

Difference between a 70 point win without pressing and 135 point win pressing the whole game, is class and respect.
[/quote]

12/03/09 4:00 PM @ Woodville (Woodville, TX) ** (Big Sandy) 102-49 (W)  
12/04/09 11:30 AM @ Legacy Christian Academy (Beaumont, TX) ** (Big Sandy) 125-54 (W)  come on aaw at what point were these games over?  What could you have done differentlt to keep it from being 71 pts?  Why not work on your passing game, or stall game.  Did you stop shooting three's, blocking shots, and fast breaking?  125 is a lot of points, what did you have at the half?  Thats pretty dang himliating too! You  shoulda have stpped at 100!








 

[AggiesAreWe]

[quote name="backdoorcuts" post="740789" timestamp="1262971149"]
[quote author=AggiesAreWe link=topic=64474.msg739947#msg739947 date=1262891686]
C'mon LAZEEK, 135 point wins don't just happen. Those kind of wins are forced.

I can respect a 70 point win by Yates after calling off the press much more than a 135 point win and pressing the enitre game.

It was just totally unnecessary.

Difference between a 70 point win without pressing and 135 point win pressing the whole game, is class and respect.
[/quote]

12/03/09 4:00 PM @ Woodville (Woodville, TX) ** (Big Sandy) 102-49 (W)  
12/04/09 11:30 AM @ Legacy Christian Academy (Beaumont, TX) ** (Big Sandy) 125-54 (W)  come on aaw at what point were these games over?  What could you have done differentlt to keep it from being 71 pts?  Why not work on your passing game, or stall game.  Did you stop shooting three's, blocking shots, and fast breaking?  125 is a lot of points, what did you have at the half?  Thats pretty dang himliating too! You  shoulda have stpped at 100!








 


[/quote]


My problem with Yates was not that they scored 170 points, but how they scored those points.

Again, Yates continued to press, Silsbee never pressed in the 2nd half. Also, they did not attempt any 3 point shots late in the game. Legacy dictated how this game got this way, Yates dictated the result of their game.

I am not for completely shutting it down and refusing to score. But if you can't see the difference in these two games, you're not that smart to begin with.

[Lazeek]

Silsbee..........what a bunch of sleezeballs!!!!! ;) :D

[dayton]

[quote name="AggiesAreWe" post="740794" timestamp="1262971497"]
My problem with Yates was not that they scored 170 points, but how they scored those points.

Again, Yates continued to press, Silsbee never pressed in the 2nd half. Also, they did not attempt any 3 point shots late in the game. Legacy dictated how this game got this way, Yates dictated the result of their game.

I am not for completely shutting it down and refusing to score. But if you can't see the difference in these two games, you're not that smart to begin with.
[/quote]

those are my thoughts as well....

I don't think they'll ever get it AAW.

Stopping the full court press, trapping, etc. for a half is not going to make someone lose their edge, IMO......

[AggiesAreWe]

I agree. Had Silsbee continued to play in the manner that Yates played the ENTIRE game, then Silsbee would have beaten Legacy by a simuliar score that Yates beat Lee.

[bullets13]

[quote name="Ron Burgundy" post="740846" timestamp="1262975731"]
[quote author=AggiesAreWe link=topic=64474.msg740822#msg740822 date=1262973304]
I agree. Had Silsbee continued to play in the manner that Yates played the ENTIRE game, then Silsbee would have beaten Legacy by a simuliar score that Yates beat Lee.
[/quote]

Except Silsbee couldn't score 170
[/quote]

they might have.  we don't know because they were classy enough to pull out of their full court press.

[backdoorcuts]

AAW,
  you are not very smart yourself if you don't see your hypocrisy.  First of all who are you to decide what's class and  classless.  It's like saying shooting someone is worse than stabbing someone, still just as dead.  You say its how they scored it, that's how they play.  You say Silsbee didn't press the 2nd half.  WTH I'm sure they didn't need to after the first 4 minutes so is it classless to press until half time and you are up thirty.  O ok society and you says that's ok TO PRESS TILL HALFTIME EVEN IF YOU ARE UP 40!  We tried to stop, bs you don't stop ANYTHING and score 125!  Yates is 150 pts better than most teams in the nation, but they should keep their production down to make everyone else happy. 

[backdoorcuts]

Matter of fact you only had 59 at halftime againt legacy.  Seems to me like the output really picked up the second half(66 pts), I can see where you guys pulled the dogs off-not! Hypocrite 

Friday, December 04, 2009  Q1 Q2 Q3 Q4 Final
Silsbee 33 26 37 29 125
Legacy Christian Academy 13 21 3 17 54

Man Legacy put up a fight in the 3 qtr. 

[AggiesAreWe]

FYI, Silsbee trailed the first 3 minutes of this game 12-7.  ;) Halftime score was 59-34. 25 point lead.


You want to use a "killing" analogy. ::)

Here's an analogy for you. One kills in self defense, the other committs murder. Both victims are dead, but only one person goes to jail. ;)


Here's another:

A person is killed by a single gunshot wound, while another is killed by a single gunshot wound but then is continued to be shot another 100 times.


Aren't these analogies pretty silly? ;D


I find it unbelievable that you can't see the difference of a team winning by 135 while pressing the entire game to a team winning by 71 that didn't.