tvc184

The article wasn't about anything in particular and is one paragraph from West's weekly Sunday diatribe. It is obvious that he was slamming the degree requirement but he wasn't writing an article about Memorial. It was just a musing at PNG's expense. I thought it was a good point..... as probably do a majority of the people in and outside of PNG.

Land's Custom Taxidermy in Bridge City used to do a great job but I haven't been to his shop in the last few years. It was great stuff the last time I was there.

I'd watch out for the nimwit talk. All information is not public contrary to your "EVERYTHING" comment. You then posted an article...... that says the "finalists" must be released according to the courts. So much for "everything". Then, how much of the application is to be released? The entire application including credit ratings or just names and schools? Better go back and rethink your post nimw... uh... The Young Coach.

Public funds does not make everything open to public view. There are plenty of things that are protected information internally. I have no clue if they have to release applicant names but to think that a public institution must disclose everything is incorrect.

Then why post them as "requirements"? I can see that all applicants will be considered but they would "prefer" a master degree. Something in this process seems like they are trying to keep some or certain people from applying. I could care less what PNG does but this doesn't seem to pass the sniff test.

You are ethical. I believe that many are not. Yes, criminals will be criminals. I think that this move would allow a criminal the "right" to be in the woods with a rifle without having to sneak around. The only way to catch a poacher in these kinds of situations is to almost be in the deer stand with the hunter to know which person pulled the trigger. I believe that it will be a way to almost legitimize poaching and make it much easier to break the law. Not for the ethical hunters but for the large number (maybe not a majority but it is substantial) of ones that are not.

Yeah, I am sure that Sulpher Springs players feel tarnished right now. Heck, next week they may even return their trophy to the UIL.

The whole point of forums is not to remain anonymous although that is a benefit to some. If a member doesn't want to meet other members then great. There are others out there that would like to meet their nemesis or maybe a like minded poster. For them, that is great also. People aren't stupid for falling in either category. Different strokes for different folks.

Just show up but don't tell any screen names. ;D

I'm just glad to see that LCM was at least added to the list.

"BUT IT"S FOR THE KIDS" I agree Lefty. I have been deer hunting for about 35 years and the October archery season was an add-on. Guns were not allowed to hunt back then and that put that extra season for bow hunters the extra time without all the extra pressure in the woods. You have to remember that bow hunters usually need to get within 20 yards of their game and normally shots are taken about about 12-18 yards. It is not like when the gun hunters are taking from 75-150 yard shots and have large shooting lanes. I hunt both gun and bow so I am not dogging out gun hunters. I just think they are trying to move in on a time that they have never been able to use for gun hunting. It is not like they took that time away from gun hunters to make room for archery. I think a lot of people that claim to be doing it "for the kids" are really doing it to get the kids out of their hair for the "real" season. Heck, the kids can hunt with the parent right now for 9 weeks of the regular season and additional time (part of it in archery season) when adults can't hunt with guns. That apparently isn't enough. That is why I have the suspicion that it is so the kid can kill a spike or a doe and get that out of the way so dad (and/or mom) can do the serious hunting or dad wants that extra chance at the monster buck before the other hunters get in there and uses the kid as the justification to be in the woods. Sorry but there it is. Also, anyone that wants to gun hunt for deer during October (or even September) can do so by starting with the MLD program. Of course, to do that they need to manage their lease and not just kill everything that moves. An MLD program lease will allow gun hunters to hunt the entire deer season (including archery) and even into February, way after everyone else has had their season end.

MLD is a little more flexible than LAMPS. From what our biologist told us is that if you are running it correctly, the state can authorize (and does) gun season to coincide with archery season. It also allows for enhanced bag limits. For example if the land is permitted to harvest 30 bucks, then 30 bucks can be taken off of the land with no regard to how many hunters you have or who kills them. That would really go well with leases with few members per acre. I hunt on less than 1,000 acres so if a state biologist decides that we can kill or need to kill 15 bucks, then they can be taken by anyone. The season can be extended from September 30th through the last Sunday in January without regard to archery, black powder or who kills the deer. It all depends on how you run your lease. If you don't follow the program then you will be denied MLD. Here is an overview of it. [Hidden Content] When our biologist talked about going to MLD (which we haven't), he said the state would start the lease out and give them goals. As they are reached and the program is followed, then the allow more levels. There are three levels to MLD. Basically you can manage your lease by the conditions on your lease and not be stuck within the state guidelines for general hunting. When you make general rules, you have to do it for the masses. When you can taylor a program for a certain piece of property, the state will be more lax in what they will allow to be killed since they want certain amounts of game taken off of the land but not without overkill. As you know on your lease as well as mine, with families hunting they can slaughter the deer herd in short order on that particular lease. The MLD tries to assure that you take enough game to keep a healthy herd with endangering it. The state may very well come in and say that your lease needs to take four does per membership and then gives the appropriate tags out. If one hunter doesn't hunt with his family, he can still take four does. On the other hand, if you have a family of 5 and they want to shoot 10 bucks, that will not be permitted since that would be permitted if you split the tags up per membership. I like the idea but I have doubts that the people on my current lease will go by it since it would restrict how many deer a family could kill. Of course, it would be up to the membership to decide how to distribute the doe and buck tags. If you read this web page from a south Texas ranch where it describes their "The Classic Whitetail Expience", it mentions that according to the MLD Level 3 plan, if you make a hunt on their lease you can kill all of the management (cull) bucks below 125" that you see. No big deal but it shows that on their ranch which is heavily managed, your basic hunting license doesn't even apply since you can take all of the culls below 125" in view. [Hidden Content]

It could be LAMPS or MLD. Of the two, I would prefer MLD.

Two bucks, two does with no permits needed in October bow season and gun season until December. Then doe opens again for 9 days during black powder season.

Yeah. That sounds more like a judge with "wishful thinking". He doesn't like the law so he doesn't think it will pass. Well the law has been in place in some Texas counties for several years and I haven't seen any appeals court challenges on the law. I will stick with, when in doubt, don't shoot.

I've got no problem with people hunting within the law. I have taken young deer also. It took a while to realize that I could kill a large older deer just as easily as I could kill a baby if we only let them grow on our lease. When we started our newer management rules, we didn't kill a buck for one year and only one the next. Now we are seeing and killing the biggest that we have ever seen in our area. That is why I am all in favor of the new proposed rules on horn size. As everyone knows, that is not the perfect answer. I wish they would say the horn size OR 3.5 years or older as some older deer need to be culled but will never fit within the horn restrictions. There will also be some nice deer with good horns that grow up instead of out and may never make the required width. If they went to a 3.5 year minimum age, it would be up to the hunter to decide if the deer was of age but he has to make that same call on horns also. I have an easier time noticing a mature deer by body size than trying to judge if the horns I am looking at are 12" or 13.5". The way we do it and the way it is taught in management circles..... if in doubt, don't shoot. That is the intent of the rules anyway. It is not to get a micrometer and see if the buck has reached the minimum inside spread or if he is three one hundreths of an inch short. Management of deer set minimum rules hoping that hunters will not take the risk of an illegal deer and allow the borderline bucks to walk. Then you take the same deer the next year when you see him and he is 15-16" and no doubt. This year you kill the borderline one from last year. East Texas can grow as big of deer as south Texas if people let them grow up. The leases down there are heavily managed with very high prices. People don't pay $2,500-$10,000 a gun (not a family) to kill a 110 pound 4 pointer. I would hate to see prices like that in east Texas but the management style would work if put in place. It seems that many east Texas hunters feel that if they see a deer, it must claimed at that moment and killed at all cost. By gosh, I so him so he is mine. I will never believe the meat issue. I only drive from south Beaumont to just past Woodville to hunt. My cost in gasoline, deer stands, feeders, corn, hunting license, lease fees and other items makes it impossible to kill deer for meat and claim that it is to feed a family. There are those people that kill deer on their own property where they live and that is different but anyone that pays for a lease to hunt and drives for any time at all is losing money for every pound of venison that they claim to be taking "for meat". I will bet that less than 2% of the "legal" hunters that take deer "for meat" are doing so on their own property and not paying lease fees.

By all means. Tyler County has a two doe limit with no tags needed. The herd needs to be thinned for better health and a better buck to doe ratio. Other areas need some does and I suspect most of the problem is with poachers in those areas of east Texas famous for such activity. It does not take long to increase the herd size however in either bucks or does if the people lay off of them for a couple of years.

On my lease a few years ago we had some silly 6 point rule. If it had 6 points, it was a "legal" buck per our lease rules. Well there is a saying. Where you start is where you will end. If shooting a 6 point is within the rules of your lease, expect that to be what is killed and you will be darn lucky to see anything else, more like a fluke. That is exactly what most hunters killed or ever saw. Once we started going for 3.5 year old minimum, we have taken several good bucks including one about 140 inches a month ago. We have several game cam pics of different large bucks that have not been killed. We are seeing more mature bucks while on stands and also on the cameras in a weekend than we saw in an entire season a few short years back. We don't have a huge lease either. It is about 970 acres in Tyler County not far from Woodville. This area is not exactly known as a trophy area yet we are getting large mature deer with good racks. Why? There is no magic or rocket science. We aren't shooting 4 or 6 pointers anymore. We are also on a family lease and if we want meat, we can kill does to our heart's content or stop off at Wal-Mart on the way home.

The reason that cull bucks and junk bucks breed in east Texas is because there are no dominant bucks and add in the fact that it is overrun with does. When deer don't live past 18 months the dominant buck and natural selection process is ruined by hunters, not nature. The new rules are working in the counties where they have been used. I don't think that is the best way to select a buck but I have seen some pure idiots trying to judge deer on the hoof. There was a guy in south Texas a few weeks ago that killed a 1.5 year old baby on a day lease while I was there and wanted to argue that it was a mature buck. Geez. Looking at horns compared to the size of the ears is easy. Being subjective about how long their brisket has extended, how much gut they have, if their back is swayed, if their face looks short and all the stuff that goes into aging deer is not or at least it appears so from the hunters that I have seen. It is simple. If the horns are outside of the ears, he is likely 3.5 years old or older and a mature deer. Unless you are on your own property and pay no fees to hunt other than a license, the meat hunt doesn't work for an excuse either for a huge majority of the people. You can buy beef, pork or chicken in a store way cheaper than you can get the same meat hunting.

Someone on texasbowhunter.com said that it was really in full swing around Eagle Pass. Maybe it's that time.

Thank you very much. A "potential" good deer is not a good buck. Therein lies the problem of small deer in east Texas. The other guy is going to kill him so I had better shoot first. I hope the state regulations kick in in all east Texas counties and it is then heavily enforced. While it is true that some true cull bucks will never be killed, in the long run it will do way more good than harm.

I think that saltwater might be easier to put on and attemd for most people. I think that a majority of our regular posters are more local to the Golden Triangle and in easy driving distance of saltwater. A trip to the lakes would be a lot more driving time for most people. I like either but the saltwater would seem to be easier to arrange.

What kind of lease (deer/duck) and where?

No he was a good buck. I should still get 4 more deer before the end of season. If he was a six point, that was either a baby or a cull. Take your pick.

Congrats to Stowers and the entire Central program. It made for a good team effort because he didn't win it alone and they didn't win on the field without his leadership. Good job all around.