oldschool2

Makes sense. Speaking of Finney.. who is another excellent coach.. I believe he missed the playoffs this year despite his track record. Just goes to show that it takes more than coaching. Still gotta have horses in the stable.

Again.. I'll never take anything away from the knowledge of Art Briles or the success he's had in his career. You do understand, though, that Mount Vernon had some pretty good seasons before Briles got there.. right? And.. Briles brought a coach with him that had a kid living with him that was a pretty good player. If I remember correctly there was an issue with it for a while concerning the district committee. Anyway.. point being that Briles stepping into an already successful Mount Vernon job is a far cry from someone stepping into a Tarkington team. That's not personal.. it just is what it is.

Again.. I'll never take anything away from the knowledge of Art Briles or the success he's had in his career. You do understand, though, that Mount Vernon had some pretty good seasons before Briles got there.. right? And.. Briles brought a coach with him that had a kid living with him that was a pretty good player. If I remember correctly there was an issue with it for a while concerning the district committee. Anyway.. point being that Briles stepping into an already successful Mount Vernon job is a far cry from someone stepping into a Tarkington team. That's not personal.. it just is what it is.

Again.. I'll never take anything away from the knowledge of Art Briles or the success he's had in his career. You do understand, though, that Mount Vernon had some pretty good seasons before Briles got there.. right? And.. Briles brought a coach with him that had a kid living with him that was a pretty good player. If I remember correctly there was an issue with it for a while concerning the district committee. Anyway.. point being that Briles stepping into an already successful Mount Vernon job is a far cry from someone stepping into a Tarkington team. That's not personal.. it just is what it is.

I have no doubt that Art Briles has forgotten more about football X's and O's then most of us will ever know.. but.. Briles coached 6 different quarterbacks that went on to play D1. Including his own son (UT and UH). Unless he's bringing that kind of talent to Tarkington.. No.. he's not replicating the success early on.

A consistent coaching staff is a fraction of a fraction of what's necessary.

I didn't say their population was growing like Aledo. I said "as far as a major influence of population growth, new business, and new money". Three separate entities but obviously not all three playing a factor in the case of Carthage. However, the upgrades were definitely made and this level of winning happened pretty close to that. Did it not? Even still.. one of multiple variables playing into Carthage's unheard of dominance in high school football over the last decade+. The reasons why Carthage has done what they did can be argued until blue in the face, doesn't negate the fact that schools will try to replicate it but fail. There's still a common factor with Carthage, Aledo, Tarkington,.. some of the schools I just listed have had / will have skill kids go on to play big time D1 football. Tarkington does not at the moment. There are steps needed to be taken in order for schools such as Tarkington to get on the track of consistent success. Even in doing so, it will take time. Will the patience of parents/community allow for the growing pains that inevitably happen during this required time? We'll see. Just know this.. Surratt and Buchanan will be listed with the greatest coaches to have ever worn a whistle in Texas High School Football, but they couldn't go to most schools in the state for a decade and replicate what has been done in Carthage and Aledo. Even if they went together.

The indoor practice facility is something that most of the state doesn't have. And their turf field is equipped with a $100K+ screen.. if that's ok, then a vast majority of the state would aspire to meet your definition of ok.

Scratch the weight room.. I'm thinking of Tatum. Carthage still has a first class playing field and practice facility. Last time I checked those were part of the facilities.

I wasn't there when the facilities were built.. but I'm pretty sure they're more recent than 60 years.

Read the rest of the comment. New natural gas discoveries in certain parts of central and east Texas have resulted in great things for a lot of school districts. Carthage's indoor practice facility, turf stadium, state of the art weight room, jumbotron, etc.. just appeared out of nowhere? Those types of perks available to athletes and students bring/keep great players and great coaches.

They were also horrible before a major population shift to the area. Carthage and Aledo are in the same boat as far as a major influence of population growth, new business, and new money. Just as schools can go from dominant to irrelevant.. so can the opposite happen. In fact.. it absolutely happens. Carthage and Aledo have some of the nicest facilities in the state coupled with communities willing to pour as much money as possible into the athletics program. Is Tarkington willing to do that?

Of course. Every year there’s a school (or multiple) that wins the title that wasn’t the most talented. But.. doesn’t mean they were without talent. Tarkington has a long way to go before becoming a consistently successful (relatively) football program. A new hire isn’t going to change that overnight.. or even over the next however many years. A lot of variables are needed.

No.. you need to recount. SIX players played in at least 30 games (over 24). SIX. SIX players played exclusively in at least 15 of the games. SIX. My guess is that those 15 games are the ones that were relatively close. And it's not splitting hairs.. I said that elite teams did in fact play that few kids. You said my "basketball knowledge needs to be questioned". And that my "take on elite teams only playing 5 guys is borderline moronic". Those were your words.. even though I didn't say they play only 5 players. No matter. Anyone can read what was posted above.

Of course not. What needs to happen is to hire the best fit for the program as the hiring committee sees fit.. but then have realistic expectations and not give the guy a reason to leave after a year or two. Someone that will be excited about raising participation and having the players actually see benefit of bettering themselves. A culture change in the program can definitely make the kids at least think about going to the weight room instead of the deer stand. But even with a change in culture and attitude be realistic about what you're wanting.. especially compared to years past. Invest money into the coaching staff, facilities, and kids as a show of faith. Is it probable to do all of that and then beat schools with decades of that exact tradition that you'll strive to have? Maybe not.. but a true change couples with some strategic scheduling can definitely lead to some 4/5/6 or more win seasons. Maybe not every year but at least competitive in some of the losses. Success breeds success so take little wins in terms of change. It's going to take time.. And please, please, for God's sake.. stick with a coach for more than a season or two. Even if it costs a little money.. make it a goal for your 7th graders to graduate under the same leadership. Consistency is vital. Even during a rebuilding year.. just freakin suck it up and go with your choice. As long as he keeps the mentality he started with and stays excited with the process... then don't let a losing season be the reason to run them off. Unfortunately.. Tarkington has always been a, "my first head job" type place and people move on to greener pastures. But who knows.

300 unathletic kids can't beat 15 good athletes. Not on the football field.

Depends on the schedule.

Hmm.. Well, according to the stats provided on maxpreps ([Hidden Content]) only 6 players for United actually played in over 24 games for the year. I'm not talking about the games in which are blowouts where even the managers get to go in.. I'm talking about actual quality minutes that happen in important, close games. What was the "minutes per game" for United's players? How many kids played in the state games? Perhaps I know a little bit about what I'm talking about.

100% correct. The quality/number of players has no bearing on success. All you have to do is hire a coach that's won state titles before. Do that.. and then watch the deep runs start rolling in.

*there

Sounds like either you or your kid needed for their to be a few more on the list to be all-district... because 8-10 per all-district team is a joke. Just make it 20. By the way.. in reality.. in almost every other area of the state, the elite teams actually do play 5 kids with a couple/few coming off the bench. Don't act like rotating 5 and 5 is normal just because some SeTx teams do it. If you think that, you should go on a field trip.

As I argued in the past: It costs a lot of money to maintain a grass field (water, mowing, maintenance, paint, fertilizer, etc.). A turf field is truly a big investment but saves money in other areas.. along with allowing all sports to use without fear of tearing up.. and in most weather conditions (wet). As for draws; nice facilities will bring players, coaches, teachers, parents, fans, playoff games, etc. Is that a guarantee? No. But kids don't transfer to a school with trash facilities because of the facilities or probably any other reason. All that aside, it's a show of faith that you care about your athletic programs and community. As good coaching friend of mine says, "if you don't turf your fields then you're losing money somewhere". And you're 100% correct, the mindset/mentality/culture of most of SeTx is for the most part stuck in the past.

And my argument was specifically for investment purposes. Both financially and in your players/community along with the potential for transfers. Recruiting without recruiting. But as I said.. it was met with the, "what we have is good enough" attitude.

Several years ago when I first became a member of this site.. I argued for the necessity of schools turfing their facilities. It was met with ridicule. Funny how a mindset changes after a few years.

Every team would go undefeated every year.