oldschool2

Valid response.

Not arguing that.

In all seriousness.. SP could be a lot better in athletics because of Port Arthur. However, their priorities are Academic UIL and One Act Play.. So that’s the type of transfer they attract. Which is fine.. but if PA were utilized better they really could be competitive.

Hard to argue. There are some definite Honorable Mentions that could be in the argument. Gotta like WOS and Newton in terms of area football. A few East/North Tx football schools that'd be good are like Gilmer, Celina, Pilot Point, and Lake Travis. Just about any head coaching job include the likes of East Bernard and Brock. My personal favorite as far as where I might have wanted my kids to go to school in this day in age for a great sports experience would be either Aledo or Brock. Any sport.

There has to be potential down there, no question. But nothing that happens at lower levels guarantees anything in the future.

Only point I was trying to make.

The conversation has been had before, but.. the Benson Williams kid was a better player than Angel. Not taking anything away because they were both great players. Especially for that classification. Point still taken. He didn't win it all with them.. but people don't realize how many things have to go right in order to win it all. I'd still take Foster to captain the ship over anyone in the area.

This is not the first time I've seen/heard of youth or junior high football teams in Hardin having some ability. I've never one time seen it translate to varsity success.

I have no problem being called bro.. I'm probably a little old to be called that or call someone that. But, whatever. And it's not an argument. You are actually helping prove the point. Half of the schools you listed will never play Hardin in football. As if it matters anyway.. because I guarantee that a vast majority of the kids that play little league football in those schools won't represent the actual varsity players when those 12 year olds get to high school. And even the relative same sized schools isn't a good representative either. Saying that Hardin is talented as 6th graders because their 6th graders beat whoever's 6th graders is similar to claiming a kid will go pro because they pitched a no-hitter in the local little league. Assume those 12 year old kids possess some ability. They won't EVER play against only the kids in their same grade once they get to high school. When they're 9th graders, they get to play everybody's 9-12 graders. That's a huge difference. Especially considering the other schools will likely have more coaches, better facilities, and more transfers. I'm sorry, but predicting the future success based on what is seen in 6/7/8 grade simply won't do anything. I won a spelling competition in my 3rd grade class one time.. does that mean I should have been a national spelling bee champion? Not hardly.

I have never nor will ever believe that a few represent the whole.. but there were 100% multiple people on this site saying that TW would bring a title by a certain year. Maybe it was the same guy that created multiple accounts but it happened. Like you said, it doesn't matter now as it didn't then. I'll agree that having an experienced coach like TW was a great hire and BH definitely benefited from it. Best of luck in the future.

I'm aware.. bro.. but what are you basing their level of talent on? 12 year old kids don't play football against other 12 year old kids that they'll play against in high school. Not at all, actually. So.. who are the 12 year old football players from Hardin playing football against that you can say they're talented? 12 year olds from East Chambers? From Woodville? Anahuac? And the number of kids that move, fail, quit, stop growing, etc. between the ages of 12 and 18 makes your comment a little useless.

How can you tell that a group is talented in 6th grade?... And.. a whole lot changes between grades 6 and 12.

My apologies.

I said that my memory was sharp.. not my mind.

I get what you're saying.. I do. But.. how long has the school been in existence? The 40s I think I read one time.. and I'm pretty sure the football history is pretty pathetic. So, up to this point.. they either CAN'T compete or they WON'T do what it takes to compete. Am I wrong about that? There's no question that the girl's side is a local power house, but what successes have been had in football? I'm genuinely curious.

Nah.. I specifically remember the conversations on this very site about him right after the hire. There were most definitely multiple people with very unrealistic expectations. Including state titles by a certain year after his hire. I may be old but my memory's as sharp as ever..

I don't think he's underrated. I believe that anyone that knows anything about basketball places him very high on their list of best coaches around here for sure. Arguably any area.

I have no idea about the past for Hardin prior to a decade or so.. but it seems (based on what I've read and heard) that expectations vastly outreach reality. There were even rumblings of a "poor performance" of this current/recent (whatever) head coach towards the end of district last year. I'm not sure it's a good situation for any coach unless they have about 6 athletic high school kids living under their guardianship when this job is taken. The kids that are there now either just can't or won't do what it takes to be competitive... or the community won't give a guy long enough to actually implement a culture/program change. Hence.. never-ending cycle. Maybe they should just drop football.

Lumberton wasn't a decent 4A team last year, right? They didn't even get in for various reasons. Meanwhile, Big Sandy went undefeated in district and multiple rounds deep, beat other 4A schools, and yes.. habitually beats bigger schools. And Kountze got a share of their district title in just one classification lower. Also.. Kountze also beat bigger schools and often does as well. Even though they're both normally on a different level (over the last decade or so) they still were able to beat much bigger schools last year. Yet Mitchell (terrible, right?) found a way to get those two wins over area coaches who frequent deep playoff runs.. with a Lumberton team minus their D1 stud from a year before that didn't make the playoffs. Save the dumb reasoning.. I absolutely believe that Foster is the best coach in SeTx and I believe Joubert is in that conversation as well. But to imply that Mitchell is a terrible coach who only rode the coattails of McClure is beyond ridiculous. He may not be the pick for Coach of the Century but he coaches his tail off and gets what he can out of what he has. People that base success on record alone are moronic. .. In my opinion.

That's me. Definitely refreshing to see FIVE on a 1st Team basketball list and FIVE on a 2nd Team. As intended... Congrats to those that made it and congrats to those that were in the conversation or even considered to be on the list.

Gotcha.

It's refreshing to see FIVE players on a 1st team and FIVE on a 2nd team. As intended.

Division 3 schools beat D1 and D2 teams every year. Non athletic scholarship should be confused with lack of talent. Congrats to your daughter on what sounds like an incredible season.

I just looked up their schedule for last year. They beat Kountze and Big Sandy in back to back games. So... if he's terrible and was carried by McClure, but beat Joubert and Foster without McClure.. what does that make them? I'm just curious.

A friend of mine showed me a YouTube clip of that last play. Dropped pop fly or not.. the girl on 3rd for Liberty would've likely tagged and scored. Either way, undoubtedly a fantastic effort and awesome series based on the scored I saw.