SCOTUS Rules Against Trump Administration IEEPA Tariffs

[TheMissingBand]

30 minutes ago, baddog said:

On the earlier tariff thread, you seemed to be very against them. Have you changed your tune? Of course I could have you mixed up with CB. 😂

Tariffs have a place… but understand that it takes careful thought and planning to effectively administer them, fully understanding all of the potential outcomes. 
 

BUT, if you put a unilateral tariff on a foreign country from which your citizens seek to purchase goods, you’re simply forcing your own citizens to pay more for the things that they want and need.  Secondly, your tariffs WILL result in a reciprocation from your target, quite simply put, they’ll stick one right back on the things we’re trying to sell to them, tamping down demand for the products that we export. 
 

It’s not a surprise to people that understand micro and macro economics that our trade deficit last year was the third highest ever recorded. The tariffs raised the cost of imported goods that Americans wanted, while simultaneously chilling the demand for American products abroad because other countries simply slapped tariffs on goods we’d like to export. 
 

It’s not a secret that the last president who took us down the tariff rabbit hole was named Herbert Hoover. 
 

This is the hidden content, please

• Sign In
• or
• Sign Up

[TheMissingBand]

4 minutes ago, OlDawg said:

Now, it will be August—at the earliest—before businesses can make longer term plans.

If POTUS wants an economic boom, keeping businesses from planning isn’t the way to do it.

These will be the most bogus USTR investigations in history. I’m taking bets they’ll be completed within 149 days.

Bingo.  
 

On a side note, I appreciate your approach. There  are several people here who can’t stand Trump or pretty much anything that he does, but on the other hand there are several who support anything Trump does, whether it’s illegal, immoral, stupid, or just plain wrong… they support it. 
 

I don’t like him, but I only complain when he’s wrong. Unfortunately, he’s wrong most of the time in my opinion.   But good for you for just stating the obvious. 

[OlDawg]

18 minutes ago, TheMissingBand said:

Bingo.  
 

On a side note, I appreciate your approach. There  are several people here who can’t stand Trump or pretty much anything that he does, but on the other hand there are several who support anything Trump does, whether it’s illegal, immoral, stupid, or just plain wrong… they support it. 
 

I don’t like him, but I only complain when he’s wrong. Unfortunately, he’s wrong most of the time in my opinion.   But good for you for just stating the obvious. 

My approach is based on policy. Nothing more. Nothing less.

As @UT alum has noted, I am a fiscally conservative libertarian…the most dispassionate of the political affiliations.

[Reagan]

25 minutes ago, TheMissingBand said:

Tariffs have a place… but understand that it takes careful thought and planning to effectively administer them, fully understanding all of the potential outcomes. 
 

BUT, if you put a unilateral tariff on a foreign country from which your citizens seek to purchase goods, you’re simply forcing your own citizens to pay more for the things that they want and need.  Secondly, your tariffs WILL result in a reciprocation from your target, quite simply put, they’ll stick one right back on the things we’re trying to sell to them, tamping down demand for the products that we export. 
 

It’s not a surprise to people that understand micro and macro economics that our trade deficit last year was the third highest ever recorded. The tariffs raised the cost of imported goods that Americans wanted, while simultaneously chilling the demand for American products abroad because other countries simply slapped tariffs on goods we’d like to export. 
 

It’s not a secret that the last president who took us down the tariff rabbit hole was named Herbert Hoover. 
 

This is the hidden content, please

• Sign In
• or
• Sign Up

Where is the tariff inflation that was supposed to happen?

[TheMissingBand]

16 minutes ago, Reagan said:

Where is the tariff inflation that was supposed to happen?

Everywhere. Go to a car dealership.  The grocery store. Any restaurant. 
 

You can’t rely on the government statistics anymore since posting numbers that don’t fit Trump’s narrative will get you fired. 
 

Here’s the thing. Year to year (1/25 to 1/26) is a modest 2.4%… not good, but not bad. UNFORTUNATELY, Pedodent Trump promised that he’d bring prices back down “on day one.”  A better question is why have prices done everything except come back down, and more importantly, is it your opinion that he lied, or that he’s failed, in your opinion? 

[OlDawg]

Need to remember:

Good policy takes a while to show benefits. Bad policy shows up almost immediately.

That’s why I’ve given time on the tariff situation. But, it’s to the point where businesses need more final clarity. Most of the clients I worked for had at least a 5 year plan for engineering projects. This is too much turmoil for them to make major investment decisions. It affects not only engineers, construction, equipment suppliers & other vendors, but also the support businesses like restaurants, safety equipment suppliers, even lodging, etc. Pretty sizable chunk of the economy.

I’d expect a builder who also wants to expand our infrastructure, and wants to ‘drill baby drill’, would know this and enact policy accordingly. People sure aren’t going to invest in Venezuela when they don’t even know what’s going on here.

[DCT]

9 hours ago, Reagan said:

Where is the tariff inflation that was supposed to happen?

 

[TheMissingBand]

7 hours ago, OlDawg said:

Need to remember:

Good policy takes a while to show benefits. Bad policy shows up almost immediately.

That’s why I’ve given time on the tariff situation. But, it’s to the point where businesses need more final clarity. Most of the clients I worked for had at least a 5 year plan for engineering projects. This is too much turmoil for them to make major investment decisions. It affects not only engineers, construction, equipment suppliers & other vendors, but also the support businesses like restaurants, safety equipment suppliers, even lodging, etc. Pretty sizable chunk of the economy.

I’d expect a builder who also wants to expand our infrastructure, and wants to ‘drill baby drill’, would know this and enact policy accordingly. People sure aren’t going to invest in Venezuela when they don’t even know what’s going on here.

Well said. 
 

But when the oil companies didn’t  pledge to invest down there immediately, Trump promised to punish them. 
 

 

[TheMissingBand]

Here’s my honest opinion.  I think that the left said some things about Trump early on that sounded ludicrous. Exaggerated, fear-mongering, etc… then you had lifelong conservatives like myself that started saying… hold on a minute, this isn’t just bluster, I think this guy really thinks he can stay in power as long as he wants-genuine dictator vibes. 
 

And today during his tantrum he says “I can destroy any country that I want.” Is that how you all feel? A President has enough power at his disposal and discretion that he can just “destroy any country” that he wants?

 

It’s okay to admit that this guy is a bad fit for the job. We made a mistake. It’s okay to say it. 

[TheMissingBand]

I guess I’m disappointed in guys like TVC. He’s spent way more time studying opinions given by various courts (including the Supreme Court) than I’ll ever spend. He analyzes, understands, and can explain his opinion of the issues in a way that’s understandable. But when you have the president attacking the judiciary THAT HE APPOINTED, accusing them of being biased, unpatriotic, under foreign influence, just because they interpreted the law in a way that restrains him from using powers to which he’s not constitutionally entitled… in a manner in which a President has never behaved before, quite frankly because it’s childish, not presidential.  But there’s no condemnation if trumps behavior from the right. 
 

People are silent because Trump is their guy. That’s the problem with America today. When good people decide that wrong isn’t really wrong because the guy doing it is on “their side,” we all lose. 

[Boyz N Da Hood]

40 minutes ago, TheMissingBand said:

Here’s my honest opinion.  I think that the left said some things about Trump early on that sounded ludicrous. Exaggerated, fear-mongering, etc… then you had lifelong conservatives like myself that started saying… hold on a minute, this isn’t just bluster, I think this guy really thinks he can stay in power as long as he wants-genuine dictator vibes. 
 

And today during his tantrum he says “I can destroy any country that I want.” Is that how you all feel? A President has enough power at his disposal and discretion that he can just “destroy any country” that he wants?

 

It’s okay to admit that this guy is a bad fit for the job. We made a mistake. It’s okay to say it. 

Its always the same ol same

"Lesser of the 2 evils"

"Look at the alternative"

I personally was ok with DeSantis, he was smeared by his own base when ppl thought he would throw his hat in the ring.. wont be long they'll praise him if he gets the nominee.. R's got 9 months. Ppl vote with their pocketbooks, nothing has changed in year 1

[baddog]

16 hours ago, baddog said:

Hypocrites…..

Google search:

 

President Biden maintained most of the trade tariffs on Chinese goods initiated during the Trump administration, even increasing duties on items like electric vehicles and semiconductors

. Former Speaker Nancy Pelosi previously advocated for using tariffs to counter China's market influence, despite criticizing specific, broader tariff implementations. 

Representative Nancy Pelosi | (.gov) +3

Key Details on Tariff Policies

• Biden Administration: President Biden left many of the 2018-2019 China tariffs in place to protect U.S. industries and address unfair trade practices. His administration further increased duties on, among other things, solar cells, aluminum, steel, and, most notably, quadrupled tariffs on electric vehicles.
• Nancy Pelosi: While Pelosi criticized the Trump administration's "chaotic" approach to tariffs as a "self-inflicted disaster" that harmed consumers, she previously supported targeted, "smart" tariffs to address unfair trade practices, particularly regarding China.
• Contextual Shift: Critics and observers noted that some Democrats, including Pelosi, historically advocated for reciprocal trade measures against China, which mirrors the protectionist rhetoric later heavily utilized by the Trump administration. 
  Facebook +6

While Biden and Pelosi often criticized the methods of the previous administration's trade policy, they did not remove the majority of the protective trade barriers

What gives?

[OlDawg]

2 hours ago, TheMissingBand said:

But when the oil companies didn’t  pledge to invest down there immediately, Trump promised to punish them. 
 

 

No he didn’t. He offered incentives for investing—not punishment. Now, you’re just making stuff up to fit a narrative.

Also, remember what I said about good policy vs. bad policy. The previous Administration’s policies stunk. It showed up immediately with over 9% inflation. Unreal.

The current Administration has lowered that inflation number down significantly to a manageable rate. Question is, with the new policy fluctuations again, will they begin creeping up, or will they maintain a 2.4-2.6?

The new Fed Chair will have a bearing since the benchmark interest rate should be around 3.5 right now at the high end.

Either way, we need stability for investments. Promises are good. Actual tangible infrastructure investments are better. The deregulation will play a big part moving forward.

[thetragichippy]

17 hours ago, TheMissingBand said:

The fact is this. The Supreme Court just said that a president doesn’t have the authority to just slam tariffs however, whenever he wants. 

The Supreme Court said he does not have the power under IEEPA to impose tariffs

 

[thetragichippy]

17 hours ago, TheMissingBand said:

I’m curious if Trump’s apparent defiance of the Supreme Court will lead us into a constitutional crisis?

Because he disagreed with the ruling and will find other avenues?   Don't you think you're being a little dramatic?  

The Biden administration not protecting the Supreme Court Justices and using a heavy hand to prevent their assaults or murders when Roe vs Wade was overturned would be closer to a constitutional crisis than this......but I believe you were silent on that

[TheMissingBand]

2 hours ago, OlDawg said:

No he didn’t. He offered incentives for investing—not punishment. Now, you’re just making stuff up to fit a narrative.

Also, remember what I said about good policy vs. bad policy. The previous Administration’s policies stunk. It showed up immediately with over 9% inflation. Unreal.

The current Administration has lowered that inflation number down significantly to a manageable rate. Question is, with the new policy fluctuations again, will they begin creeping up, or will they maintain a 2.4-2.6?

The new Fed Chair will have a bearing since the benchmark interest rate should be around 3.5 right now at the high end.

Either way, we need stability for investments. Promises are good. Actual tangible infrastructure investments are better. The deregulation will play a big part moving forward.

This is the hidden content, please

• Sign In
• or
• Sign Up

Exxon’s ceo told Trump that Venezuela is currently “uninvestable” and Trump responded by saying that he’d keep Exxon out of Venezuela. 
 

It happened. 
 

"I didn't like Exxon's response," Trump told reporters on Air Force One on his way back to Washington on Sunday. "I'll probably be inclined to keep Exxon out. I didn't like their response. They're playing too cute."

[baddog]

15 hours ago, TheMissingBand said:

Go to a car dealership

2022….no new vehicles on lots due to repercussions of Covid induced supply chain shortages. Mostly because of computer chip shortages. Prices soared by tens of thousands.

[TheMissingBand]

20 minutes ago, thetragichippy said:

Because he disagreed with the ruling and will find other avenues?   Don't you think you're being a little dramatic?  

The Biden administration not protecting the Supreme Court Justices and using a heavy hand to prevent their assaults or murders when Roe vs Wade was overturned would be closer to a constitutional crisis than this......but I believe you were silent on that

I wasn’t even posting back then.  

[TheMissingBand]

2 minutes ago, baddog said:

2022….no new vehicles on lots due to repercussions of Covid induced supply chain shortages. Mostly because of computer chip shortages. Prices soared by tens of thousands.

They did… supply and demand happened. Supply dropped while demand actually INCREASED because the Trump, then Biden Administrations saw fit to dump Trillions of dollars into the economy in the form of direct payments to citizens, PPP loans to business who didn’t need them, and weren’t required to pay them back, and fraud. Inflation soared, due to COVID and lax fiscal policy between 2020 and 2022. 

It was brought back under control during the latter part of the Biden administration, and has lingered at persistent levels since. Not good, but not horrible either. The problem is that Pedodent Trump claimed he’s lower costs on day one… you’d expect to see deflation-a lowering of prices. The only place that you’re seeing that is in the price of oil.  The exact opposite of “drill baby, drill”. They’re stacking rigs all over America because OPEC is ramping up supplies and now you’ve got the flood of stolen oil from Venezuela hitting the price of oil, too. Cattle prices are insane. Grocery prices are insane. Orange juice is $7 gallon.  Tbones were on sale at Brookshire’s last week for $9.99/pound. When people complain about prices, we get told “it’s a democrat hoax.”  No, sir… the fact that it costs me $22-25 a day to sit down and eat lunch isn’t a hoax. 

[OlDawg]

59 minutes ago, TheMissingBand said:

This is the hidden content, please

• Sign In
• or
• Sign Up

Exxon’s ceo told Trump that Venezuela is currently “uninvestable” and Trump responded by saying that he’d keep Exxon out of Venezuela. 
 

It happened. 
 

"I didn't like Exxon's response," Trump told reporters on Air Force One on his way back to Washington on Sunday. "I'll probably be inclined to keep Exxon out. I didn't like their response. They're playing too cute."

It’s not a punishment to say you ‘might be inclined to keep someone out’ that didn’t want to invest there in the first place.

Exxon has been around a lot longer than Trump. They’ll be here long after he’s gone.

[baddog]

8 minutes ago, TheMissingBand said:

They did… supply and demand happened. Supply dropped while demand actually INCREASED because the Trump, then Biden Administrations saw fit to dump Trillions of dollars into the economy in the form of direct payments to citizens, PPP loans to business who didn’t need them, and weren’t required to pay them back, and fraud. Inflation soared, due to COVID and lax fiscal policy between 2020 and 2022. 

It was brought back under control during the latter part of the Biden administration, and has lingered at persistent levels since. Not good, but not horrible either. The problem is that Pedodent Trump claimed he’s lower costs on day one… you’d expect to see deflation-a lowering of prices. The only place that you’re seeing that is in the price of oil.  The exact opposite of “drill baby, drill”. They’re stacking rigs all over America because OPEC is ramping up supplies and now you’ve got the flood of stolen oil from Venezuela hitting the price of oil, too. Cattle prices are insane. Grocery prices are insane. Orange juice is $7 gallon.  Tbones were on sale at Brookshire’s last week for $9.99/pound. When people complain about prices, we get told “it’s a democrat hoax.”  No, sir… the fact that it costs me $22-25 a day to sit down and eat lunch isn’t a hoax. 

Man, I actually agree with everything you said except that it’s all on Trump. Your house can burn down in a matter of hours. Can it be rebuilt in hours? Trump has no magic wand for lowering prices. Inflation is terrible and prices suck, but we’re all in this together. Finger pointing never solved anything. Maybe, just maybe, if Trump didn’t have a federal judge (always a dem appointee) stopping everything the man is trying to accomplish, the gears could start turning. None of us want dictators, but to go by the decision of one judge, seems a bit dictatorial to me. Beef has been ridiculous for some time now. $75-100 for a brisket. It’s actually cheaper to eat steak in a restaurant, well, almost. Everyone wants Trump to “fix it”, but with every turn, he is blocked. Really, how can anyone expect to get things done if every move made is blocked. Seems like a conflict of interest to me.

[OlDawg]

Man! Where the heck are y’all buying groceries?

KROGER:

Choice Boneless Beef Brisket Untrimmed Whole in Bag (Limit 1 at Sale Price)

$3.99/lb.

I never pay full price even before inflation.

Pork Butt was $.99/lb. last week. I’m smoking it tomorrow, vacuum packing what we don’t eat for stuffed spuds, brisket enchiladas, & barbacoa tacos. We gat about 4 different meals for about $12.00 total for the main course. 😀

 

[TheMissingBand]

8 minutes ago, baddog said:

Man, I actually agree with everything you said except that it’s all on Trump. Your house can burn down in a matter of hours. Can it be rebuilt in hours? Trump has no magic wand for lowering prices. Inflation is terrible and prices suck, but we’re all in this together. Finger pointing never solved anything. Maybe, just maybe, if Trump didn’t have a federal judge (always a dem appointee) stopping everything the man is trying to accomplish, the gears could start turning. None of us want dictators, but to go by the decision of one judge, seems a bit dictatorial to me. Beef has been ridiculous for some time now. $75-100 for a brisket. It’s actually cheaper to eat steak in a restaurant, well, almost. Everyone wants Trump to “fix it”, but with every turn, he is blocked. Really, how can anyone expect to get things done if every move made is blocked. Seems like a conflict of interest to me.

I plainly said Trump, then Biden contributed to the inflation that we had during Covid. 
 

Three of the justices that shut down the tariffs yesterday were conservatives.  They just didn’t ignore the law in favor of what Trump wanted. 

[baddog]

1 minute ago, TheMissingBand said:

I plainly said Trump, then Biden contributed to the inflation that we had during Covid. 
 

Three of the justices that shut down the tariffs yesterday were conservatives.  They just didn’t ignore the law in favor of what Trump wanted. 

Well, I said federal judge, not SC justice. I realize who did what. That’s all you got from my post? I spent a little time on it and even agreed with you.

[LumRaiderFan]

19 minutes ago, OlDawg said:

Man! Where the heck are y’all buying groceries?

KROGER:

Choice Boneless Beef Brisket Untrimmed Whole in Bag (Limit 1 at Sale Price)

$3.99/lb.

I never pay full price even before inflation.

Pork Butt was $.99/lb. last week. I’m smoking it tomorrow, vacuum packing what we don’t eat for stuffed spuds, brisket enchiladas, & barbacoa tacos. We gat about 4 different meals for about $12.00 total for the main course. 😀

 

And what about that $22 to $25 lunch?

I could give him some recommendations. 🙂