thetragichippy

And the next generation will be the gr-gr-grandfather...then the next will be the gr-gr-gr-grandfather, then the next...... No matter how many generations you look at (and it has been about 7 generations or almost 150 years ago), when do you move on? 200 years? 300? Exactly!

OK, completely honest here. Educate me if I off on this point. I have never been poor. I was never raised poor. BTW, poor meaning homeless, on government assistance. I'm not rich by any means. However my father was poor. He was raised on a 18' houseboat in Lousiana till he was about 14. His father semi abused him. He had my Father drive a boat 8 miles up a river, drop him off and he had to drive it back by himself. He waited 8 hours for his father to return. Oh yea, he was 8 years old at this time. His Dad was a trapper. Even though my father was poor I was not. I have NO CLUE what it is to possibly not eat one day. He tells me stories of his younger years that I can't imagine that happening to me. All his stories did was to convince me not to ever be in that situation. Now, slavery..........it was bad, but no one on this forum lived it. So, why keep bringing it up?

yea, I got off topic. Yea, no more torture chambers, mass killings by the leader of the country you live in, their daughters wont get raped by Sodom Insanes sons.............. I predict Bush will not go down like the left intends. It will backfire just like Pelosi!

Ok, you said there were no white slaves, there were........now you bring up you dont need a history lesson. PNGkid is throwing facts as I do to support my statements. The history is history, it cannot be changed, BUT we can learn from it. In order to learn from it, you have to know it and understand it! About 40 messages ago I gave my spill on the things I thought Bush did well. I have to agree, Homeland security is one of the best things he's done. Although I did pose the question about if white people had been slaves...earlier than that, I posted that there were white people that were indentured. I believe there is a slight difference in the two. My eternal thanks to you and kid for "learning" me about slavery with all of your facts. Sadly, many facts have never been published in books, but as long as America was able to prosper and the select few were able to become profiteers at the expense and maltreatment/murder of others...hey, it's all good. I don't know what his legacy will be. Maybe that he rid the world of hussein, but at what expense? 9/11 was a test that no one could have truly been ready for. I think that we had no other choice than to go after binladen and it was the right thing to do, but I think that invading Iraq was not. I mean, in the history books, what will be said about why we invaded Iraq besides that hussein was responsible for some horrific atrocities. I just wish that he would have had the ability to either realize that he made a mistake (and not just with Iraq) and apologize for that particular decision. "Sadly, many facts have never been published in books, but as long as America was able to prosper and the select few were able to become profiteers at the expense and maltreatment/murder of others...hey, it's all good". Translation: When facts don't meet my agenda, I will blame the history books.........but it's all good! Translation: I am willing to not just accept what I am told and think outside the box. My agenda is to not think that it's ok that these things happened because it was just accepted, our country would have never been, people in other countries like Africa were doing it, so it should be all good. Why do you blame the history books? History books have tended to undermine the tragedies of slavery (at least the ones that I remember reading), but no GREED and LACK OF COMPASSION FOR THEIR FELLOW MAN are to blame. You are a funny little man. (I guess!) I didnt blame the history books, you do. You said, "Sadly, many facts have never been published in books". That's was a point you made to support your statements. History books are hopefully factual. If you want compassion read a romance novel. Again, we have to accept what happened in the past.....it's factual. Hopefully we will learn from it. I will never teach my son to fly a kite(with a metal key attached) in a lightning storm.........got that from a history book. I'm going to be shallow again and call you a left winger.........you had to resort to calling me a little man ;D I'm enough of a man not to get in a name calling contest with you.

Agree and disagree at the same time. The only difference I see is that he may be from the same town as the officers, however that should not make a difference. What was the same: 1. Both in a ditch 2. One accused of being under the influence, the other uncooperative to the point a sobriety test was unable to be performed. 3. Both resisted arrest 4. Both tasered 5. Both died It's a sad situation. I'm curious if the death resulted from the taser, the alcohol or drugs, or a combination of both.

Yea, I agree.......just wanting to get bullets in the tourney.

I couldn't have made it any more simple than I did. At that time, the equation was something like this: No slavery = No Ratification = No Constitution = Weak, disorganized USA = Probable British Invasion = No USA Slavery = Ratification = Constitution = Strong, centralized USA capable of beating off British invaders (which we did in the War of 1812) It's as simple as that. Sure, it was morally wrong, but sometimes things don't go as well as we'd like them to. Occasionally, we have to make a few concessions on a few issues. In the end, slavery was abolished and it's still useless to argue a 220+ year-old decision. Ok, you said there were no white slaves, there were........now you bring up you dont need a history lesson. PNGkid is throwing facts as I do to support my statements. The history is history, it cannot be changed, BUT we can learn from it. In order to learn from it, you have to know it and understand it! About 40 messages ago I gave my spill on the things I thought Bush did well. I have to agree, Homeland security is one of the best things he's done. Although I did pose the question about if white people had been slaves...earlier than that, I posted that there were white people that were indentured. I believe there is a slight difference in the two. My eternal thanks to you and kid for "learning" me about slavery with all of your facts. Sadly, many facts have never been published in books, but as long as America was able to prosper and the select few were able to become profiteers at the expense and maltreatment/murder of others...hey, it's all good. I don't know what his legacy will be. Maybe that he rid the world of hussein, but at what expense? 9/11 was a test that no one could have truly been ready for. I think that we had no other choice than to go after binladen and it was the right thing to do, but I think that invading Iraq was not. I mean, in the history books, what will be said about why we invaded Iraq besides that hussein was responsible for some horrific atrocities. I just wish that he would have had the ability to either realize that he made a mistake (and not just with Iraq) and apologize for that particular decision. How about we knew he had WMDs, he had UN resolutions to answer to, he had to let our weapons inspectors see if he was indeed hiding anything (we know he was, what do you think he did, kissed those 250,000 Kurds to death?). Our inspectors were getting close and he ordered them at gun point to leave, which they did. Do you think he got rid of those weapons during that time? Hmmmmm. Sadaam Insane had scud (dud) missiles to deliver his explosives. I, to this day, don't know how we kept the Jews from all out attacking him. We kept them at bay by protecting them with our patriot anti-missile defense system. Some scuds still got through and did some damage and killed some people. Do you realize the magnitude of the situation, had he been able to hit the Jews with a WMD?????? Anyone here that doesn't think Sadaam Insane had WMDs is a fool. BTW, where were you when all of this was taking place....under a rock? One more thing. Americans did not execute Sadaam Insane. We turned him over to the Iraqis and they let him drop. I still love what the soldiers said to Insane when they found him....''Greeting from President Bush!" GREAT POST!!!!! I can't understand how some of you people let Bush and Cheney pull you off track to think Sadaam was the enemy? We had reason to believe that Sadam Hussein was hiding weapons of mass destruction within the borders of Iraq as early as 1998. This was a clear violation of the treaty Iraq signed with the United States and the United Nations after the first Gulf War. President Bush was taking care of an issue that President Clinton refused to take care of. I support our decision to go into Iraq; however, I do believe that this war has been handled badly. Much like in Vietnam, we let politics get involved in a war that didn't need politics. We should have kept the promises we made to the Iraqi people at the beginning of the war, and I truly believe that President Bush did his best to keep those promises (i.e. infrastructure upgrades, schools, hospitals, etc.), but it's not easy to run a war when you've got some prominent members of Congress that won't cooperate and keep calling in the media every time they have a score to settle. Ok, you said there were no white slaves, there were........now you bring up you dont need a history lesson. PNGkid is throwing facts as I do to support my statements. The history is history, it cannot be changed, BUT we can learn from it. In order to learn from it, you have to know it and understand it! About 40 messages ago I gave my spill on the things I thought Bush did well. I have to agree, Homeland security is one of the best things he's done. Although I did pose the question about if white people had been slaves...earlier than that, I posted that there were white people that were indentured. I believe there is a slight difference in the two. My eternal thanks to you and kid for "learning" me about slavery with all of your facts. Sadly, many facts have never been published in books, but as long as America was able to prosper and the select few were able to become profiteers at the expense and maltreatment/murder of others...hey, it's all good. I don't know what his legacy will be. Maybe that he rid the world of hussein, but at what expense? 9/11 was a test that no one could have truly been ready for. I think that we had no other choice than to go after binladen and it was the right thing to do, but I think that invading Iraq was not. I mean, in the history books, what will be said about why we invaded Iraq besides that hussein was responsible for some horrific atrocities. I just wish that he would have had the ability to either realize that he made a mistake (and not just with Iraq) and apologize for that particular decision. You truly believe that there's a 140 year-old conspiracy to cover up facts about slavery in our history books? Where's your evidence? Lumping all these agencies into one completed the communications that was missing before. Some say 9/11 could have been prevented if everyone would have communicated. It's not a perfect system, but better than we had. FEMA we could debate. Although, I agree it needs some tweaking, I think some people want FEMA to be a save all, do all, and I disagree. Local governments are in charge of disaster relief, then FEMA should step in afterwards. Agreed. DHS isn't perfect, but increased efficiency, improved security, and played a pivotal role in keeping a post-9/11 America safe. Ok, you said there were no white slaves, there were........now you bring up you dont need a history lesson. PNGkid is throwing facts as I do to support my statements. The history is history, it cannot be changed, BUT we can learn from it. In order to learn from it, you have to know it and understand it! About 40 messages ago I gave my spill on the things I thought Bush did well. I have to agree, Homeland security is one of the best things he's done. Although I did pose the question about if white people had been slaves...earlier than that, I posted that there were white people that were indentured. I believe there is a slight difference in the two. My eternal thanks to you and kid for "learning" me about slavery with all of your facts. Sadly, many facts have never been published in books, but as long as America was able to prosper and the select few were able to become profiteers at the expense and maltreatment/murder of others...hey, it's all good. I don't know what his legacy will be. Maybe that he rid the world of hussein, but at what expense? 9/11 was a test that no one could have truly been ready for. I think that we had no other choice than to go after binladen and it was the right thing to do, but I think that invading Iraq was not. I mean, in the history books, what will be said about why we invaded Iraq besides that hussein was responsible for some horrific atrocities. I just wish that he would have had the ability to either realize that he made a mistake (and not just with Iraq) and apologize for that particular decision. How about we knew he had WMDs, he had UN resolutions to answer to, he had to let our weapons inspectors see if he was indeed hiding anything (we know he was, what do you think he did, kissed those 250,000 Kurds to death?). Our inspectors were getting close and he ordered them at gun point to leave, which they did. Do you think he got rid of those weapons during that time? Hmmmmm. Sadaam Insane had scud (dud) missiles to deliver his explosives. I, to this day, don't know how we kept the Jews from all out attacking him. We kept them at bay by protecting them with our patriot anti-missile defense system. Some scuds still got through and did some damage and killed some people. Do you realize the magnitude of the situation, had he been able to hit the Jews with a WMD?????? Anyone here that doesn't think Sadaam Insane had WMDs is a fool. BTW, where were you when all of this was taking place....under a rock? One more thing. Americans did not execute Sadaam Insane. We turned him over to the Iraqis and they let him drop. I still love what the soldiers said to Insane when they found him....''Greeting from President Bush!" And the bad part about that is the fact that the world would have screamed had Israel been attacked by Iraq and we had had a chance to stop it. It's kind of funny how that works. Not to mention Isreal don't take any crap...(can I say that here?).....Anyway, they have a goos armed forces and would not be afraid to use it.

Sorry man........was hoping I would get atleast 1 1/2 more boats, but it looks like this is what we got. Still would like to get a partner for bullets. I can fish 3 out of my boat very comfortably. Anyone have any ideas on that? Otherwise, its still on!!! TVC, we need to get together this week (either by phone or in person) and hash out the details!

Ok, you said there were no white slaves, there were........now you bring up you dont need a history lesson. PNGkid is throwing facts as I do to support my statements. The history is history, it cannot be changed, BUT we can learn from it. In order to learn from it, you have to know it and understand it! About 40 messages ago I gave my spill on the things I thought Bush did well. I have to agree, Homeland security is one of the best things he's done. Although I did pose the question about if white people had been slaves...earlier than that, I posted that there were white people that were indentured. I believe there is a slight difference in the two. My eternal thanks to you and kid for "learning" me about slavery with all of your facts. Sadly, many facts have never been published in books, but as long as America was able to prosper and the select few were able to become profiteers at the expense and maltreatment/murder of others...hey, it's all good. I don't know what his legacy will be. Maybe that he rid the world of hussein, but at what expense? 9/11 was a test that no one could have truly been ready for. I think that we had no other choice than to go after binladen and it was the right thing to do, but I think that invading Iraq was not. I mean, in the history books, what will be said about why we invaded Iraq besides that hussein was responsible for some horrific atrocities. I just wish that he would have had the ability to either realize that he made a mistake (and not just with Iraq) and apologize for that particular decision. How about we knew he had WMDs, he had UN resolutions to answer to, he had to let our weapons inspectors see if he was indeed hiding anything (we know he was, what do you think he did, kissed those 250,000 Kurds to death?). Our inspectors were getting close and he ordered them at gun point to leave, which they did. Do you think he got rid of those weapons during that time? Hmmmmm. Sadaam Insane had scud (dud) missiles to deliver his explosives. I, to this day, don't know how we kept the Jews from all out attacking him. We kept them at bay by protecting them with our patriot anti-missile defense system. Some scuds still got through and did some damage and killed some people. Do you realize the magnitude of the situation, had he been able to hit the Jews with a WMD?????? Anyone here that doesn't think Sadaam Insane had WMDs is a fool. BTW, where were you when all of this was taking place....under a rock? One more thing. Americans did not execute Sadaam Insane. We turned him over to the Iraqis and they let him drop. I still love what the soldiers said to Insane when they found him....''Greeting from President Bush!" GREAT POST!!!!!

I bet you are! There were 134 officers in 2008 killed in the line of duty protecting us from criminals. There have been 48 already for 2009. Everytime an officer finds someone in a ditch or pulls someone over, they never know if they are going to be added to this list.

Ok, you said there were no white slaves, there were........now you bring up you dont need a history lesson. PNGkid is throwing facts as I do to support my statements. The history is history, it cannot be changed, BUT we can learn from it. In order to learn from it, you have to know it and understand it! About 40 messages ago I gave my spill on the things I thought Bush did well. I have to agree, Homeland security is one of the best things he's done. Although I did pose the question about if white people had been slaves...earlier than that, I posted that there were white people that were indentured. I believe there is a slight difference in the two. My eternal thanks to you and kid for "learning" me about slavery with all of your facts. Sadly, many facts have never been published in books, but as long as America was able to prosper and the select few were able to become profiteers at the expense and maltreatment/murder of others...hey, it's all good. I don't know what his legacy will be. Maybe that he rid the world of hussein, but at what expense? 9/11 was a test that no one could have truly been ready for. I think that we had no other choice than to go after binladen and it was the right thing to do, but I think that invading Iraq was not. I mean, in the history books, what will be said about why we invaded Iraq besides that hussein was responsible for some horrific atrocities. I just wish that he would have had the ability to either realize that he made a mistake (and not just with Iraq) and apologize for that particular decision. "Sadly, many facts have never been published in books, but as long as America was able to prosper and the select few were able to become profiteers at the expense and maltreatment/murder of others...hey, it's all good". Translation: When facts don't meet my agenda, I will blame the history books.........but it's all good!

Sound Familiar: LA MARQUE, TX (KTRK) -- Family members are left with a lot of questions about the death of their loved one while in police custody. Police say Jamal Valentine was in a fight with officers in a ditch on Main Street in La Marque last night. He was hit with a Taser and died shortly afterwards. We tried to talk to the police chief there this morning, but he won't comment. The district attorney's office has now taken over this investigation and the burden of answering a grieving family's questions. Terrell wants to know how an encounter with police ended with his stepson's death. "I just want to know what happened," said Terrell. "That's all, just want to know what happened." Terrell says someone called his family overnight to warn them the 27-year-old Valentine was in a fight with police in the roadside ditch. But that's all he heard until his wife turned on the morning news. "She said, 'I think that's our son, Troy'," said Terrell. Overnight La Marque police confirmed they had shocked Valentine with a Taser. Officers told us they found him rolling around in a ditch, under the influence of alcohol or drugs. But when they tried to arrest him, officers say he put up a struggle. "That could be," said Joe Spiller, Valentine's grandfather. "He struggled, but they didn't have to kill him. That's for sure." Valentine's family says doctors at the Mainland Medical Center in Texas City told them they tried to revive him, but failed. Relatives tell us Valentine had two children, a boy and a girl, both under the age of three. Those relatives say he struggled with his life, but lost his chance at a promising future. "Good boy," said Spiller. "He was a good kid." The officers involved in this incident have been taken off the street until an investigation is complete. The DA's office has not returned our calls, but we will let you if we hear of any new developments. Lesson would be to stay out of the ditches, there is the problem.

You know he is hoping and praying that in a week or two that this will be water under the bridge. He has probably told Pelosi to SHUT UP! EXACTLY....

Lumping all these agencies into one completed the communications that was missing before. Some say 9/11 could have been prevented if everyone would have communicated. It's not a perfect system, but better than we had. FEMA we could debate. Although, I agree it needs some tweaking, I think some people want FEMA to be a save all, do all, and I disagree. Local governments are in charge of disaster relief, then FEMA should step in afterwards.

Obama sure has stayed out of it. I'm waiting to see his reaction...........

Yea, it was Bushes fault. Funny how Obama is changing his mind on a lot of security issues...... acting a little like Bush. Bush was not as dumb as the left plays him. For a dumb guy, he sure got a lot of things done. Correction: played him. They can't play President Bush for dumb when President Obama starts doing the same things President Bush did while in office. Oh, wait, they're liberals. They don't have to make sense. Nevermind, then. .. Oh and how correct you are about Bush not being dumb...he scarily smart. Left. Right. Left. Right. Someone doesn't agree with your views and you crown them liberals or lefties. Can you say shallow? I'm not sure why you would call that shallow. I would say bush was far right and Obama is far left. There are some people who views are in the middle. Most people that are liberal (left wing) admit it proudly, same for the right. Shallow would be not caring or wanting to know about fact and history.......

Ok, you said there were no white slaves, there were........now you bring up you dont need a history lesson. PNGkid is throwing facts as I do to support my statements. The history is history, it cannot be changed, BUT we can learn from it. In order to learn from it, you have to know it and understand it! About 40 messages ago I gave my spill on the things I thought Bush did well. I have to agree, Homeland security is one of the best things he's done.

It is a big deal. It was a big deal when Hitler was conquering lands. The Constitution DID NOT guarantee everyone freedom because at the time it was created...not all were free. The fact that you state you see no slaves today is how it should have been from day one. Didn't many people come here to escape religious persecutions and to be able to form a democratic society where all should have the rights to all that the Constitution represents? I guess all of the formerly oppressed groups should just feel blessed that we've come so far? Sorry, but if the foundation of our country states that ALL are guaranteed freedoms and liberties...ALL is a fairly defining word. While I am glad that I am here, the fact that one group of people profited at the expense of another through oppression, abuse, neglect, murder, separating families...that turns my stomach as I type this. I think that walking in other's shoes "may" change people's views. Kind of gives a new perspective on things. No, the Constitution did not create slavery...in an indirect way, I would have to respectfully disagree that it did not condone it because through inaction, that's essentially what happened. The fact that slavery existed...so. Religious persecutions and dictators and all of the other potentially harmful ways of the world were also here before the Constitution was here, but again...those were also ideals and things that our forefathers believed should not be a part of our America. The United States might not have lost 140,000 lives had slavery not been allowed to become a disgusting part of who we were supposed to be. We just executed Saddam Hussein because of how he treated his countrymen (and others) and the atrocities that he masterminded and followed-through with and we want to lead these other countries to be a democratic society where freedoms are a "guarantee"...yet, it took us how long to guarantee those freedoms to our own citizens and countrymen? How would you feel if you were a slave (a mother) whose "master" stole her child and sold that child to another owner because he was so determined to break her? Not much different than what Hitler and the Nazis did during WWII. I would ask you to think about that for a little more than a minute. Slavery was accepted back then. I'm glad we abolished it, but it was not just in the United States. When you say selling a mothers child, they did that in Africa as well. No matter what Country, it's still wrong. America figured that out over time. There is still slavery in Africa. I never hear blacks speaking negatively about Africa. Dick Vital actually thought African groups never took over lands. The more you look at both countries, the more we "were" the same.........now we are different in many ways, such as America has no slaves. Accepted you say? By who? It shouldn't matter that "it was not just in the U.S." Our U.S. was supposed to be better than that. Who cares what they did in Africa? Atrocities have happened all over the world, then and now...that does not justify (or at least should not justify) the atrocities of slavery in this country in the past. And, you are right...the more we look at both countries and others, the more we were the same...except that America was supposed to be founded on the notion that EVERYONE was guaranteed FREEDOM and EVERYONE did not include EVERYONE until not so long ago. From the initiation of the Constitution...America should have had no slaves. How would we feel if white people had been the slaves? I know I wouldn't be a happy camper...or slave. I would have a hard time believing that anyone would. Of course, I would have probably been lynched or hanging in the next tree because what's right is right and what's wrong is wrong, no matter There were white slaves....... Originally in the American colonies, 1600 to 1800, Native Americans and other groups, mostly white Europeans such as captured soldiers, minor criminals, etc., were used as slaves Jamestown, Virginia in 1619 as indentured servants. The transformation from indentured servitude (servants contracted to work for a set amount of time) to racial slavery happened gradually. There are no laws regarding slavery early in Virginia's history. By 1640, the Virginia courts had sentenced at least one black servant to slavery. Three servants working for a farmer named Hugh Gwyn ran away to Maryland. Two were white; one was black. They were captured in Maryland and returned to Jamestown, where the court sentenced all three to thirty lashes -- a severe punishment even by the standards of 17th century Virginia. The two white men were sentenced to an additional four years of servitude -- one more year for Gwyn followed by three more for the colony. When I said accepted, it was lawful.

Yea, it was Bushes fault. Funny how Obama is changing his mind on a lot of security issues...... acting a little like Bush. Bush was not as dumb as the left plays him. For a dumb guy, he sure got a lot of things done.

It is a big deal. It was a big deal when Hitler was conquering lands. The Constitution DID NOT guarantee everyone freedom because at the time it was created...not all were free. The fact that you state you see no slaves today is how it should have been from day one. Didn't many people come here to escape religious persecutions and to be able to form a democratic society where all should have the rights to all that the Constitution represents? I guess all of the formerly oppressed groups should just feel blessed that we've come so far? Sorry, but if the foundation of our country states that ALL are guaranteed freedoms and liberties...ALL is a fairly defining word. While I am glad that I am here, the fact that one group of people profited at the expense of another through oppression, abuse, neglect, murder, separating families...that turns my stomach as I type this. I think that walking in other's shoes "may" change people's views. Kind of gives a new perspective on things. No, the Constitution did not create slavery...in an indirect way, I would have to respectfully disagree that it did not condone it because through inaction, that's essentially what happened. The fact that slavery existed...so. Religious persecutions and dictators and all of the other potentially harmful ways of the world were also here before the Constitution was here, but again...those were also ideals and things that our forefathers believed should not be a part of our America. The United States might not have lost 140,000 lives had slavery not been allowed to become a disgusting part of who we were supposed to be. We just executed Saddam Hussein because of how he treated his countrymen (and others) and the atrocities that he masterminded and followed-through with and we want to lead these other countries to be a democratic society where freedoms are a "guarantee"...yet, it took us how long to guarantee those freedoms to our own citizens and countrymen? How would you feel if you were a slave (a mother) whose "master" stole her child and sold that child to another owner because he was so determined to break her? Not much different than what Hitler and the Nazis did during WWII. I would ask you to think about that for a little more than a minute. Slavery was accepted back then. I'm glad we abolished it, but it was not just in the United States. When you say selling a mothers child, they did that in Africa as well. No matter what Country, it's still wrong. America figured that out over time. There is still slavery in Africa. I never hear blacks speaking negatively about Africa. Dick Vital actually thought African groups never took over lands. The more you look at both countries, the more we "were" the same.........now we are different in many ways, such as America has no slaves.

If you quit bringing up all those points, then maybe we could agree on some things........but your the one that brought up Race!

Here is your problem or your crutch DV, you assume that anytime anyone says anything against another person and the person happens to be black, then that must be the cause. Obama hasn't caught nearly the flak (yet) that Bill Clinton ended up catching. Was it because Clinton was.... what? He wasn't black so that can't be it. Maybe it was because he was from Arkansas... yeah, that's it. The people that don't like Obama is because they don't like spending even more tax money on bailouts (they didn't like it under Bush either), they don't like the cutting of military programs, they don't like his anti-gun stance, etc. Put a white guy in the same place (like Clinton) and you will get the same responses..... and did. TVC, if he did what you recommended, then he would have to take personal accountability for his actions........it's much easier for him to blame it on his color!

(A) Bullying use to be called The Manifest Destiny and ( An example? Sure, remember "Shock & Awe? In response to (A), thanks for proving one small part of my point. In response to (, Shock & Awe wasn't "bullying," it was a military operation designed to demoralize the Iraqi army by putting on, literally, a fireworks show by repeatedly bombing strategic targets or the remains thereof, causing a decline in the will to resist and ultimately saving American lives. "Bullying" suggests that the operation was pointless violence, and it most certainly was not. Virtually no lives were lost in Operation: Shock & Awe on either side. It was just a way to "soften up" Iraq, much the same way we did in Vietnam with Operations: Linebacker, Linebacker II, and Rolling Thunder and in WWII with the intense bombardments of Normandy immediately previous to Operation: Overlord and the various Pacific islands we took during our "Island Hopping" campaigns. You are characterizing me as a racist based on the area I live in, and, frankly, I find that characterization insulting and slanderous. You, sir, are the ignoramus in this situation. You make claims with absolutely no evidence to affirm them and do so based solely on emotions and hearsay. I have nothing against President Obama based on his race or questionable religous background; my only concerns are based on his political positions and agendas. The idea that I am a racist is something that you are inferring with no factual basis whatsoever. BandKid, you crack me up..........what are you going to college for? If you say your not, me and you are going to have a problem!

Instead of name calling, why don't you argue your facts.......remember your post: Excellent post by stang and I will admit, tvc makes a fairly good point as well, but I have do disagree when you say that taking one's land is "no big deal". It is a VERY big deal...You don't see that as a wrong doing, tvc? Can you name a group of Africans that stole any land? What about on the Australian continent? You said it was a common practice and I sorely disagree with you...It was common among EUROPEANS, maybe, but it was not a common practice to bully land and cheat people out of what was already claimed. We have all game examples proving you're wrong........... All you have left is name calling???

Now look what we got... A president who spent BILLIONS to bail out GM, and they are still going bankrupt. Someone who said he would reverse many of Bush's "controversial" terror war measures, but he is still going on with the tribunals, not releasing pictures (although he said he would), and not going to close Gitmo. On top of that our Speaker (two heart beats away from the presidency) has lied so many times the last three weeks she can't even say her words from the heart in a news conference. Bush may have made some mistakes, but the democrats sure don't have clean hands in all this mess we are in. All within a 100 or so days.................