WildcatBacker

the problem is you haven't discredited anything. you can believe whatever you want, but beating several 4A teams that will be going to the playoffs and likely winning games there is not equal to blowing out several 3A schools who will end up winning 3 or so games each only because they get to play each other.

Ok. Lol.. 

First off, lets get it right. Kirbyville has faced FOUR teams with 1-5 records, not 3. OF was a good win, and Woodville's 4-2 record is a direct result of beating those same 1-5 teams that Kirbyville did. We saw how weak they are when they played a couple of quality opponents back to back, losing by a combined 100 points or so, so I don't think the record tells the story there.
HJ's opponents are 4-3 against mostly good 4A competition, and against teams that have played tough schedules, while K-ville's 1-5 opponents are 1-5 against mostly weak 3A competition. and big bad Tatum has 3 losses against top-10 4A schools, two of them by 7 points or less. OF is 4-3 with losses against HJ, Buna, and Kirbyville. Hard to fault them for those three losses or act like they're not good because of them. I don't have the time to dig through all the records, nor the inclination at this point, because the Hawks could beat the Seattle Seahawks and you'd give it equal weight to Kirbyville beating Deweyville by 60. But again, I know you're a Kirbyville homer, and want to find anyway you can to give Kirbyville the advantage (just as I would HJ), but there's a huge difference to beating a bunch of 4A schools with good football teams than there is to blowing out a bunch of 3A JV squads. Any of the 5 teams that HJ has beaten that I would call quality teams would've done the same thing to those 3A JV schools that Kirbyville has done, which is why I don't give them a whole lot of credit for doing it.

You just basically made the exact same argument that I've already discredited, so I'm not responding to that. I'm responding simply to say that I didn't include one of the 1-5 teams because they were a common opponent with HJ. (Kountze)

I'm actually ok with the rankings.  They are just for fun.  But I would like to say that Kirbyville is a 3A School with a smaller enrollment than HJ (4A) and still beat the common opponents by a larger margin. 

I agree, and I'm ok with the rankings too. I really am. I have no problems at all with HJ being #1 and us being #2. What I had issue with was that a stronger argument could be made for Kirbyville being #1 than HJ and the response I got was 'stiffer competition'. That dog won't hunt.  

This is for the EC and Kirbyville fans: :D

http://www.texas2afootball.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=11065

 

 

 

Just Kirbyville fans: :(

http://www.texas2afootball.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=11064

Wow. This is awesome. Thank you for posting this. Kirbyville is the only team in 3a with a top 5 offense AND defense. I hope we can continue this trend, but we've got Buna and EC coming up so I'm not sure if it'll happen. Very nice to see though up to this point.

I want to add one thing....I do think that HJ is a really good team. I just don't think the reasoning that puts them ahead of Kirbyville in the ranking holds any water. But my opinion doesn't count.  :)

Your point was not missed, it just has very little merit.  Beating good teams is more difficult than blowing out bad teams.  There are probably 20 teams in 4A/3A in our area that could line up Kirbyville's schedule and have a bunch of blowout wins.  There are only a handful of teams that could do what HJ has done.  And while Kirbyville is almost assuredly one of those teams, they haven't proved it on the field. And your "measuring stick" isn't relevant because it doesn't take into account how much harder it is on a team both mentally and physically to play several quality opponents back to back, versus a team that plays a good team that they can get up for, prepare for, and rest up for in the middle of a bunch of cupcakes.  There's a reason that undefeated mid-major teams don't play for college championships. An undefeated team from the WAC with a bunch of blowouts will never get the nod over an undefeated team from a big conference who's consistently beaten quality teams.  It's much tougher to "do what good teams are supposed to do" against consistently good opponents than it is to run off blowout after blowout against teams that Kirbyville's JV team could beat.  But as i just said, there's a reason that 8 out of 10 knowledgeable, non-biased voters placed HJ ahead of Kirbyville.  So maybe they missed the point as well?

Ok I will from here on stop giving the benefit of the doubt and will start doing my own research. I mean really?? What 'good' teams are you talking about? I checked.....the BEST record of the 5 teams HJ has beaten (not counting common opponents with Kirbyville) is 4-3! One is 2-3 and even big, bad Tatum is a freaking 2-4!! Give me a break. These are the 'good, quality' teams that are beating up on and taking their toll on HJ's season??? Wow. Lmao.. I'm sorry to be the one to tell you, but 4-3 is average. The others are below average. Kirbyville has faced three teams with a 1-5 record and one that's 4-2 (which we beat 56-0), and I'll admit that 1-5 is weaker competition than 4-3, but if you want to claim MUCH tougher competition then you're gonna have to come at me with some 6-1's or even some 5-2's. 4-3 ain't cuttin' it. Just, wow. I guess next you're gonna want us to look at the opponents competition too right? Then their opponents opponents? Lol.. It doesn't matter though. HJ is ranked ahead of Kirbyville and that's just the way it is. I can't stop laughing though at how tough HJ has it. Those 'average' teams are a doozy huh? Lmao

Maybe Kirbyville did better against those teams because they weren't beat up and worn out from playing good teams week in and week out?  Should Kirbyville be ranked higher than HJ because OF recovered a couple of onside kicks late in a game that HJ was winning handily?  Or should HJ be ranked ahead of Kirbyville because they have 5 wins against playoff teams while Kirbyville has 4 wins against 1-5 teams?  Should Kirbyville be pushed down because they only beat Anahuac 28-7?  Both Buna and EC beat them by more.  When you argue scoring margin, especially games where both teams were clearly the better team, it's not a great measuring stick.  Considering that HJ runs an offense that is made to milk the clock and keep opponents' offenses off the field, it's not going to be a shock when they don't run up the score as much.  But that doesn't mean that they aren't a great team, nor is it an indicator of what would happen if Kirbyville and HJ were to play.  Since they won't play, you have to look at other factors.  And clearly the majority of people living anywhere outside of Kirbyville feel that HJ's quality wins against a stronger schedule gives them the edge in the rankings over Kirbyville  If not, HJ would not have 8 of 10 1st place votes as picked by some very good football minds living throughout the coverage area.  And just for your information, there's not a single HJ OR Kirbyville fan voting in the poll, so it's about as unbiased as you're going to get.

Aaaaaand yet again, you miss the point. These polls are set up as conversation pieces to give people an idea of who is (or might be) the better team. I will admit, Kirbyville didn't face hardly any quality opponents so they did what a good team is supposed to do, they beat the tar out of them. HJ faced mostly quality opponents so they did what a good team is supposed to do, they won. So as far as teams that were NOT common, they both did what they were supposed to do. Which leaves us with opponents that ARE common and CAN provide a measuring stick to some degree of a head to head face-off between Kirbyville and HJ. And in those games, Kirbyville fared better. You can reason out all day long as to why they did, but they did. That's all that matters. 

Kirbyville wins. Then Ec beats buna the following week.

I hope this is the way it happens. I really do. If Kirbyville or EC loses to Buna then that will take all the glitz and glamour off the Kirbyville/EC game at the end of season. Lol..

There's no "quite" to it, HJ's schedule is MUCH, MUCH, tougher than Kirbyville's up to this point, and while Kirbyville is finally going to get a couple of good opponents, HJ still has WOS. But I'll repeat, because while I made my point earlier, I took a lot of words to do it. HJ was chosen #1 over Kirbyville because they have beaten 5 quality teams, and Kirbyville has only beaten one. It's not the strength of schedule: it's being undefeated against a much stronger schedule. You can't say only their two common opponents matter, but not the 4 other good teams HJ has beaten (versus 4 bad teams that Kirbyville has). It's about the whole season, not the fact that Kirbyville beat OF by 15 and HJ only did by 7.

Ohhhhh.....so actual games that could be used to compare the two don't matter? Only games that have no way of pointing out how good the two teams are head to head? I gotcha. Btw, Orangefield was not the only common opponent. There was also Kountze, which HJ beat by 3 td's. Kirbyville beat them by 6. Not surprised you left that out.

that's the problem when you don't play anybody good in predistrict. Kirbyville's most impressive win is against OF. HJ also beat OF, but it might be their 4th or 5th most impressive win. It also came on the heels of victories over Tatum, Center, and LCM the previous three weeks. One could argue that playing quality competition 4 or 5 weeks in a row takes it out of a team in a way that playing bad teams, resting starters and generally avoiding injuries doesn't, leading to games like HJ/OF the other night where a couple of mistakes allowed OF to turn the game from a borderline blowout (HJ was on pace to win the game by more than Kville had beaten them by)to a closer win by scoring 14 points in the last 2:30 of the game. The last four weeks Kirbyville has beaten Woodville, Deweyville, Anahuac, and Kountze. So the voters have to look at what's more impressive: Kirbyville outscoring a couple of teams by a couple more touchdowns than HJ while working their way through a cupcake schedule, or HJ continuing to beat quality opponents just about every week. What's worth more? HJ beating a playoff team in LCM by 28 and a playoff team in Center by 31,traveling to perennial state power Tatum and holding them to 2 first downs in a 7 point win... or Kirbyville hanging up 50 every week on teams that are going to go 2-8.

By all accounts Kirbyville has a great team. And from what I've heard (no, I'm not driving to watch them play), they have the talent to give HJ a game, and maybe even be a favorite to beat them. As they finally get into district and play a couple of good teams in EC and Buna, they'll get the respect you guys want if they win both games(as if #2 is something to sneeze at). Of course, if HJ beats WOS in two weeks, you're going to be stuck at #2 until somebody knocks HJ out of the playoffs.

Kirbyville's most impressive win is against everyone they've faced. Their pre-district schedule may not be quite as tough as HJ's but they are doing just exactly what great teams are supposed to do to not so great teams....they're destroying them. When facing good teams though, especially common opponents such as Kountze and Orangefiled, that's the only measuring stick that voters can go by. And again, Kirbyville wins that battle so far. I'm not saying that HJ doesn't deserve to be #1, I'm just wondering why they were chosen over Kirbyville to be there. So it's strength of pre-district schedule? Kind of a lame reasoning....especially when 2 out of 6 opponents were faced by both teams. You are right though...until someone knocks them off, they will stay there. 

I hate Kirbyville.....

Hate stems from fear...

I think WO-S will be very surprised at how good Orangefield is. They have only lost 3 games so far......and ALL 3 were to undefeated teams.They were a play or two away from being undefeated themselves. Lost by 2 scores to Kirbyville, one score to HJ, and one POINT to Buna. Yea I think they are a lot better than most Mustang fans will be expecting.But who knows anymore. Lol..

well both teams suck ass so it doesnt matter which one to choose right???

You're an idiot..

Kirbyville is the better team and will win this game very easily. It won't be 56-0, but it will be decisive. Somewhere in the range of 3+ td difference. 

FYI Up to Week 7

 

               District Overall

School        W-L-T         Pct      W-L-T        PF         PA

EC               3-0-0           1         6-0-0         221         59

Kirbyville     3-0-0          1         6-0-0       243       61

Buna           3-0-0          1        6-0-0       201        85

Woodville   1-2-0          .333      4-2-0       125       147

Hardin        1-2-0       .333       3-3-0       121      160

Kountze     1-2-0       .333       1-5-0       192      271

Anahuac    0-3-0            0         1-5-0         27      157

Warren       0-3-0            0         1-5-0      112      214

Hahaha....nice. Very subtle EC Fan#1. Lol.. Most would have them listed in alphabetical order. Lol..  :D

Yet again, HJ beats a team by less than what Kirbyville beat them by, but still gets ranked ahead of them. Smdh.. Oh well. Good luck to the Hawks for the rest of the season. You have done some great things this year even if the common opponent scores were not as impressive as Kirbyville's. I wish with all that I have that we could have played y'all this year. That would have been the game to see.

Well heck, an argument could even be made for Buna to be above WO-S. Buna is undefeated, but WO-S has lost 2 games. Also, what's significant is that one of those losses came to Newton.... cause Newton lost to Orangefiled, who lost to BUNA! These rankings are fun, and interesting, and I know they are nothing more than conversation-inspiring opinions, but still....some teams have done more than others to earn the higher ranking, so it should have been given to them. 

In the 3A/4A poll, #'s 1 & 2 should be swapped. Kirbyville has earned a #1 ranking more so than HJ for 3 reasons...Reason #1) Their lowest pt total for the yr was 28 (against Anahuac), but the most they've given up was 27 (against Orangefield). That means that even the best offense faced did not score enough to top what the best defense held us to. Not the case with HJ. Their highest # of pts allowed was 28 (against Kountze), but their lowest pts scored was 21 (against Tatum). If you're not understanding, let me put it this way.....if you take Anahuacs defense and Orangefields offense, and put them on the same team, they still could not have beaten Kirbyville. The score would have been 28-27. But if you take Tatum's defense and combine them with Kountze's offense, then HJ could have a loss of 21-28. Reason #2) Against common opponents, Kirbyville did MUCH better. In this case, they both have only faced Kountze, but Kirbyville scored 7 more pts and gave up 14 fewer than HJ did. That's a +21 edge in favor of Kirbyville. And Reason #3) In games played so far, HJ has won by an avg of 38-15. Kirbyville's margin of victory has been 43-12. Yet HJ is ranked above us. Why? Why is the opinion there that HJ is better? I just gave you reasons to put Kirbyville first....someone please explain why HJ should be first. 

I commented on the Kountze team not mine. You commented on your team. I did not. LOL checkmate. You don't give up do ya.

Misdirection won't work either my best good EC buddy. Lol.. Your comment was in reference to the reasons why Kirbyville did so well against Kountze, while EC struggled against them. I pointed out that the same could be said for Kirbyville's Anahuac game vs EC's Anahuac game. Their is no checkmate cause this game's been over. I already put the board up, put everybody to bed, and have been sitting on the porch for a while now drinking my adult beverage. :P  

We lost because we had to play a college team, The University of Kirbyville.

Not yet. Got a few more weeks till you have to say this..  ;)

 

 

I should have read this on your other post before I commented on here. Dang it. LOL I like it when you give me ammo. LOL Remember you used this about your QB. I think this might be checkmate.LOL I know, all this talk means nothing but it passes the time until the real game.

 

WildcatBacker posted on another Thread:

"Our starting (whatever) was out of the game - A team consists of 11 guys on the field at one time. If you have 11 guys on the field, then you are equal to the team you're facing. No one player should be carrying a team and if they are, then you have trouble from the start. A chain is only as strong as it's weakest link, not it's strongest link."

 

Oh no, no, no, no, NO! Lol.. Good try though. My comment was in response to YOUR original comment that Kountze wasn't at 100% when they played us and so y'all deserved credit for it. I was pointing out that by YOUR logic, then we faced the same thing in the Anahuac game. I wasn't making excuses, you were. Dang this is fun. Lol..

I am lmao at where this thread has gone. Lol.. Forget I even brought it up. We'll just say one run of 98 yds that ends with a fumble on the one. Those 98 yds are nothing but a stat. They didn't help AT ALL on winning the game. THAT was my point. Lol..

You know what's sad? There are 3 teams in our district that would take 1st place in a LOT of other districts. But the fact is........one of them has to be 3rd. Wow. That alone tells you how tough this district is. The #1 that comes out of it will have earned it for sure.

EC has had a min of 2 and up to 4 starters out just about every game. Sooooo by that logic EC is the better team. LOL That my story and I'm sticking to it. Again. LOL you know we could do this till the end of the season.  :D I do like your passion for the kats. Time will tell the truth in the end.

 

You had no comments on my Region picks. How about 3 teams in our district? How about 12 3A-D1 the hardest district in 3A football? Nothing? Man I gave you a lot to talk about and nothing but defence on Kirby. :P Ok I'm over it. Let's talk football.

Sorry. I had every intention of commenting but I kept having to hype my K-cats on other threads. Lol.. I'm not real familiar with teams outside of our region, but like someone said earlier, I would LOVE it if Pilot Point makes it and we do too. We owe them. :angry:   

What about when kville played WOS, and the scoreboard read 21-20 (I think) and Fred Ford went for a 2pt. Conversion for the win and the Ref. Said no good when the film showed that he crossed the plain of the goal line.......yea, I brought it up again d!...lol

Hey I'm right there with ya! :rolleyes:  I was at that game too. Everyone and their brother saw him cross the line except for the one that mattered....the ref. Lol.. So WO-S go the W whether they earned it or not. The next year we took it to them though.