stevenash

[quote name="BADSANTA" post="1227755" timestamp="1338515735"] Really? PM and we can play tomorrow [/quote] Yeah, sure.  Your record at following through on these matches is questionable.  If you are serious, you PM me and the match will be arranged and I will give you two to one odds.

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227758" timestamp="1338515921"] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=100318.msg1227735#msg1227735 date=1338511376] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=100318.msg1227730#msg1227730 date=1338509723] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=100318.msg1227726#msg1227726 date=1338509197] Yates is on a whole nother level folks. They play a national schedule alongside with national exposure. Build and they shall follow. Also, these so-called elite kids  ::) hang, text, Face Book, etc each other. They ask their pardners to follow them to certain programs. Others want to play in the best programs. Wise's program sells itself. [/quote] Many thanks for acknowledging/verifying that this program is, as you say, an elite program which suggests that all high school coaches, in order to compete, ought to be AAU coaches in the off season and develop relationships with players who, at that time, do not attend the school where they are coaching.  OF course, Mr. Wise NEVER discusses attending Yates as a possibility.  He merely lets his current players sell the program on Facebook.  I never realized that, at the high school level, that this was supposed to take place.  Somebody once told me that the competition was intended to take place between schools of similar size with no outside influence.  If enough other schools pick up on these "methods" Texas High School Basketball ought to become very interesting.  I am amazed at some people who belittle "the rich" and how they take unfair advantage of everyone else and yet, at the same time, admire situations such as this one. [/quote]I said "SO-called" elite kids." Coach Wise can't coach kids who attend Yates. Be interesting to see how many kids played on his AAU teams and transferred to Yates. The players I know at Yates did not playy for Wise's AAU team. [/quote] NOT ONE!! It is a PROVEN fact! One could say the same for HJ's "Little Dribblers" [s]recruiting[/s], ERRR, I mean program, if thats the case.... ::) ::) [/quote] Your last "proven fact" was torn down by Westend when he gave your 4 names.  Yes, there really is a lot of heavy duty recruiting of those 8 year olds in HJ Little Dribblers.  However, you still need to live in the HJ district in order to play.  But comparing 8 year olds to a high school program is certainly a valid comparison.

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="1227726" timestamp="1338509197"] Yates is on a whole nother level folks. They play a national schedule alongside with national exposure. Build and they shall follow. Also, these so-called elite kids  ::) hang, text, Face Book, etc each other. They ask their pardners to follow them to certain programs. Others want to play in the best programs. Wise's program sells itself. [/quote] Many thanks for acknowledging/verifying that this program is, as you say, an elite program which suggests that all high school coaches, in order to compete, ought to be AAU coaches in the off season and develop relationships with players who, at that time, do not attend the school where they are coaching.  OF course, Mr. Wise NEVER discusses attending Yates as a possibility.  He merely lets his current players sell the program on Facebook.  I never realized that, at the high school level, that this was supposed to take place.  Somebody once told me that the competition was intended to take place between schools of similar size with no outside influence.  If enough other schools pick up on these "methods" Texas High School Basketball ought to become very interesting.  I am amazed at some people who belittle "the rich" and how they take unfair advantage of everyone else and yet, at the same time, admire situations such as this one.

[quote name="westend1" post="1227632" timestamp="1338490215"] Clearly, they are having more move-outs than move-ins.  Except for basketball players.  Coincidence? [/quote] Westend- Although we are often diametrically opposed on the political front, permit me to congratulate you on a brilliant conclusion. Kind of reminds me of a song entitled " Things That Make You Go Hmmm"

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227618" timestamp="1338488616"] [quote author=westend1 link=topic=100318.msg1227614#msg1227614 date=1338488444] If they have so many move-ins, why are they dropping to 3A? [/quote] They actually should NOT be...Thats a great point! It will be a two year experiment...Thats all. [/quote] Which part is the "great point"?  Having so many move ins?  Or moving to 3-a?

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227587" timestamp="1338485803"] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=100318.msg1227586#msg1227586 date=1338485696] [quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=100318.msg1227583#msg1227583 date=1338485363] Maybe scenery and academics.... ::) ::)..Isn't that the attraction for Hardin Jefferson? [/quote] Good answer.  Once again, very logical.  Here is another way to look at it.  Why dont we simply take the number of players on both teams varsity and multiply it by 5 ( total players on varsity over 5 years) and see what percentage consitutes "move ins"?  Hj's is going to be around 1%.  Are you claiming the same for Yates? [/quote] Again...can't compare by those numbers....Houston has 100 times more kids than does the Sour Lake, China, Cheeks, (and Beaumont) areas combined...It SHOULD be more... [/quote] Really?- You are the one who touted how "home grown" the Yates team was.  By the way, percentages usually are the great equalizer when there are huge disparities in absolutes.

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227583" timestamp="1338485363"] Maybe scenery and academics.... ::) ::)..Isn't that the attraction for Hardin Jefferson? [/quote] Good answer.  Once again, very logical.  Here is another way to look at it.  Why dont we simply take the number of players on both teams varsity and multiply it by 5 ( total players on varsity over 5 years) and see what percentage consitutes "move ins"?  Hj's is going to be around 1%.  Are you claiming the same for Yates?

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227576" timestamp="1338484714"] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=100318.msg1227570#msg1227570 date=1338484165] [quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=100318.msg1227569#msg1227569 date=1338484071] Devante Johnson - previously played at Beaumont Central ::) Ratio 4:1 Houston is at least 4 times larger than Sour Lake I would call that one about EVEN! [/quote] Yep- 1 kid in five years is very comparable to multiple kids year in and year out.  Gotta hand it to you- very compelling logic and certainly representative of a "pipeline" [/quote] One in five years? OK, I will let that go...Why do you think that Yates is just that slick to be able to just break rules and have no consequences? [/quote] Why did the four players listed above all choose Yates out of all the schools available in the Houston area?

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227569" timestamp="1338484071"] Devante Johnson - previously played at Beaumont Central ::) Ratio 4:1 Houston is at least 4 times larger than Sour Lake I would call that one about EVEN! [/quote] Yep- 1 kid in five years is very comparable to multiple kids year in and year out.  Gotta hand it to you- very compelling logic and certainly representative of a "pipeline"

Shai Fields previously played at Pearland Maurice Letcher-Ellis previously played at Cy Springs, (UIL ruled in his Case) Damyeon-Dotson previously played at Madison, Charles Bennett previously played at Milby Dickie- Lets go ahead and discuss this "pipeline" from Beaumont to Sour Lake that you continually refer to but never follow up on.  Show me how all of your connections and knowledge make your allegation a fact.  From my viewpoint, 1 player in 5 years does not constitute a pipeline but, of course, I don't "know" things like you do.  As previously stated, bring something a little more credible than the weak "Liberty" accusation.  You will also need a little larger volume of players in order to make it to the "Yates league".

Created this one for the sake of staying on topic as requested.  Fire away Dickie and tell us why Nederland and HJ are equivalent to Yates in terms of move-ins, recruits, or whatever label you want to assign to it.

Just one that "we will admit to"? Go ahead and name a few others.  It should be easy for you because, as you stated, you know "everybody" and "everything". 

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227547" timestamp="1338482101"] VAST MAJORITY does not equal 100% "homegrown"....In that case, the VAST MAJORITY of the Yates kids are DEFINITELY not only HOME grown, but NEIGHBORHOOD grown...the VAST MAJORITY of them are....point? [/quote] Hmmm_ Hj has had one move in over the last five years and Westend just gave you a list that is considerably larger than that for Yates

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227534" timestamp="1338481209"] [quote author=Honest Abe link=topic=100215.msg1227531#msg1227531 date=1338480866] [quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=100215.msg1227519#msg1227519 date=1338479871] MOST SE Texans who really do not know, are the ones accusing them of cheating...I was informing you that while there were transfers to Yates, like anywhere else, there were no rules broken, or recruitment. [/quote] Like Westend said, he named Not 1, not 2 or 3, but FOUR names and you are still denying it!! We ALL know there is 'recruiting' that happens, so to deny it is ignorant, and I KNOW you are not ignorant!! Is it LEGAL recruiting?? Very possibly, bc there has not been an investigation YET!! ;) Some of us don't need PROOF to know what is going on.... 8) [/quote] No denying anything...I acknowledged the guys that he named and told him that they were not "pulled" to Yates at all...They transferred there, yes, but every rule was enforced and followed...Can't deny that....Hey Abe...Are all the Nederland kids "homegrown" as stevenash tries to tell us that the HJ kids are?  ::) ::) [/quote] Dickie- The VAST MAJORITY of HJ players are homegrown.  You also know that but can't let yourself acknowledge it.  So now you pursue another school in an effort to justify Yates?  What a joke.

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227519" timestamp="1338479871"] MOST SE Texans who really do not know, are the ones accusing them of cheating...I was informing you that while there were transfers to Yates, like anywhere else, there were no rules broken, or recruitment. [/quote] Even though you will not acknowledge, you know VERY WELL that the "transfers" are SIGNIFICANTLY more prevalent at Yates than at other schools.  Of course, that is just a mere coincidence.

[quote name="king" post="1227429" timestamp="1338435330"] 44 points by Rondo. Played entire game. [/quote] IF there are any Rondo doubters out there who happened to watch him play the entire game plus overtime, how can anyone not be convinced?

Sure but we both KNOW how much WEAKER our pre district schedule is.

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="1227257" timestamp="1338400326"] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=100175.msg1227250#msg1227250 date=1338399854] [quote author=BLUEDOVE3 link=topic=100175.msg1227235#msg1227235 date=1338396979] [quote author=catfever link=topic=100175.msg1227116#msg1227116 date=1338384207] If you get 3rd in district 21-3A, you will play Yates in the 2nd round if you win the 1st round.  You know what that means.  The 1st place team in 21-3A will play them in Regional Quaterfinals.  2nd place will have the easier route, but still have to beat Yates.  All this is based on this past years bracket. [/quote] Interesting!  I bet there will be some calls made to Austin [s] from HJ[/s].... ERRR I meant 21-3A reps to get the  rearranging  process started this year ;D [/quote] HJ wont make the playoffs- weak schedule [/quote] Weak schedule pre-district but will make playoffs  ::) [/quote] Wont matter- if pre district is that weak, they will most certainly lose first round if they got lucky and made the playoffs

[quote name="BLUEDOVE3" post="1227235" timestamp="1338396979"] [quote author=catfever link=topic=100175.msg1227116#msg1227116 date=1338384207] If you get 3rd in district 21-3A, you will play Yates in the 2nd round if you win the 1st round.  You know what that means.  The 1st place team in 21-3A will play them in Regional Quaterfinals.  2nd place will have the easier route, but still have to beat Yates.  All this is based on this past years bracket. [/quote] Interesting!  I bet there will be some calls made to Austin [s] from HJ[/s].... ERRR I meant 21-3A reps to get the  rearranging  process started this year ;D [/quote] HJ wont make the playoffs- weak schedule

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227177" timestamp="1338387310"] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=100215.msg1227169#msg1227169 date=1338386759] A kid from liberty moved to Sour Lake and once he found out VIA THE HJ COACHES that he would be INELIGIBLE, he moved right back to Liberty. Obviously, he never played at HJ. Apparently, all those VALUABLE and RELIABLE sources of yours neglected to tell you the whole story.  Additionally, you only think you know everybody. [/quote] Do you KNOW how many kids were TURNED AWAY from Yates? Yet, people STILL want to hang them for kids wanting to go there....So I guess the Beaumont ISD annexation/pipeline is not a topic that can be discussed? And yes nash, I DO know EVERYBODY. ;) [/quote] Sure it can be discussed- fire away- Lets keep the topic to things that you "really" or "actually" know instead of throwing out things like the Liberty stuff ( which you had "heard" but really didn't know)

A kid from liberty moved to Sour Lake and once he found out VIA THE HJ COACHES that he would be INELIGIBLE, he moved right back to Liberty. Obviously, he never played at HJ. Apparently, all those VALUABLE and RELIABLE sources of yours neglected to tell you the whole story.  Additionally, you only think you know everybody.

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227137" timestamp="1338385401"] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=100215.msg1227131#msg1227131 date=1338384964] [quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=100215.msg1227121#msg1227121 date=1338384458] Oh, but its an accurate statement, and you know it..... ;) [/quote] One town with one school district with 500 students Major metropolitan area with multi districts and hundreds of thousands of students-  Accurate?  Sure?  Keep telling yourself and maybe you can possibly believe it but it really ought to be hard even for an one accomplished in self delusion [/quote] One town? China, Cheeks, Sour Lake, Liberty (yeah, I heard about those kids), Beaumont (we all know HJ is the better choice for scenery and academics, right?)....That covers a lot more area than just one little town, don't you think? Come on, nash...I know too many people...You can fool others about how HJ has never taken kids from other districts (purposely or not) but I know too many people for that...way too many people...and other coaches....Don't get me wrong, if you build a great program, that just may happen, and its ok....But just understand that Yates has the same "problem" that you guys have... ;) [/quote] I could give a rats A$$ about who you know.  Having been around this world longer than you have, it's no contest regarding who one "knows".  1 kid in 5 years is still a fact that you cant alter via innuendo or otherwise.  Go ahead and tell me what you know about Liberty and what benefit it provided for HJ.  China, Cheek and Sour Lake are all components of the HJ school district. 

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227121" timestamp="1338384458"] Oh, but its an accurate statement, and you know it..... ;) [/quote] One town with one school district with 500 students Major metropolitan area with multi districts and hundreds of thousands of students-  Accurate?  Sure?  Keep telling yourself and maybe you can possibly believe it but it really ought to be hard even for an one accomplished in self delusion

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227067" timestamp="1338350733"] [quote author=Stevenash link=topic=100215.msg1227045#msg1227045 date=1338340091] [quote author=Dick Vitale link=topic=100215.msg1227017#msg1227017 date=1338333187] He went to Austin w/ FB Hightower 3 times...And now 3 times at Yates winning two....I would say that he is getting it done wouldn't you? Coincidence? I doubt that...The talent IS coming to Yates now that it has been built...Just as it appears at HJ...Does the talent level dip there? Not much...why does it have to just fall off at Yates....Did it fall off at Lincoln? Ozen? Silsbee? Why Yates? [/quote] HJ "talent" is 99% home grown ( of course you already know that and it troubles you)  Yes, it fell off at Ozen [/quote] If the HJ talent is 99% "homegrown" then Yates' is around 98%.... ::)...because they are after all from Houston.... ::) [/quote Nice try  logic attempt very sad

[quote name="Dick Vitale" post="1227017" timestamp="1338333187"] He went to Austin w/ FB Hightower 3 times...And now 3 times at Yates winning two....I would say that he is getting it done wouldn't you? Coincidence? I doubt that...The talent IS coming to Yates now that it has been built...Just as it appears at HJ...Does the talent level dip there? Not much...why does it have to just fall off at Yates....Did it fall off at Lincoln? Ozen? Silsbee? Why Yates? [/quote] HJ "talent" is 99% home grown ( of course you already know that and it troubles you)  Yes, it fell off at Ozen