**HARDIN-JEFFERSON vs CLEVELAND... HJ wins 75-68!

[stevenash]

[quote name="indian15/16" post="976512" timestamp="1299172875"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=81003.msg976504#msg976504 date=1299172439]
[quote author=indian15/16 link=topic=81003.msg976499#msg976499 date=1299172035]
Wow, as always some accurate takes and some misguided ones as well. First, congrats to HJ. I wish Coach Sutherland and the team all the best at regionals. Like it was stated, it's hard not to pull for those kids. I have to give my thoughts on the game last night. It was a compelling game and for the most part hard fought. These two teams are shadows of one another in many ways, but like in years past, the "management" of the teams was the deciding factor once again. The officiating was suspect at times but it always will be. That is just the human element. You can't be right all the time. Coach Sutherland can take decent talent with dedication and turn them into bonafied basketball players. Pruhomme has been talked up all year on this site and he is pretty good not great. His greatest talent is he just plays harder than most. What I'm trying to say is, he gets the most out of what he's got. The best player on that team is Gus. He makes every teamate better and able perform while he does the dirty work. The rest of the team will feel his absence next season big time. I hate to see this type of ending for the Indian seniors. My heart goes out to them, a large portion of their failures were not their fault. I will leave it at that. We have plenty of talent in waiting, our freshman class is legit. Cleveland will be back and maybe better than ever. Great season Indians! We love you guys. Agian, good luck to the Hawks.
[/quote]

I have to respond here.  I would say that if you score 33 pts in a playoff game against an athletic and highly ranked team like Cleveland, you are, in fact, great.  Countless times, Mr. Prudhomme also got rebounds, put backs, and a rather large rejection against a substantially larger opponent who was hailed as unstoppable and the difference maker.
[/quote]I knew you of all people would get hung up on that. I paid him a compliment. He had a great game. He's not a great player, yet. I will wait to see how his game is without Gus and then decide.
[/quote]

Evaluating greatness, of course, is simply a matter of personal perspective.  What he got done under the basket last night both offensively and defensively were not dependent on Gus.  I happen to agree with you that Gus is virtually unreplaceable for HJ but I have watched Prudhomme in every single varsity game he has played and thus feel I have a reasonably good perspective on him and his rate of improvement.

[stevenash]

[quote name="speechless" post="976515" timestamp="1299173165"]
yep cause hj gonna just flat run outta pg's when gus leaves ::)
[/quote]

Yeah, and HJ is having a down year, the talent pool is dry, and they will probably discontinue basketball.

[TeamJagUS]

[quote name="stevenash" post="976540" timestamp="1299174975"]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=81003.msg976515#msg976515 date=1299173165]
yep cause hj gonna just flat run outta pg's when gus leaves ::)
[/quote]

Yeah, and HJ is having a down year, the talent pool is dry, and they will probably discontinue basketball.
[/quote]

nah, i hear bluedove is house shopping somewhere north and west  :o

[BADSANTA]

Sutherland could coach Vidor to a 4A titl

[stevenash]

Didnt Mr. English already accomplish that?

[86hawk]

[quote name="BADSANTA" post="976566" timestamp="1299176670"]
Sutherland could coach Vidor to a 4A titl
[/quote]
Did you see Lazeek's post?? I hear Sutherland is going to Silsbee to replace their coach.  I guess Silsbee wants that state title in basketball real bad..

[indian15/16]

[quote name="speechless" post="976515" timestamp="1299173165"]
yep cause hj gonna just flat run outta pg's when gus leaves ::)
[/quote]Like Gus, absolutely, and don't even start with some garbage about Bosha. Gus's heir apparent was not on the court last night. Maybe they hid him at the sub varsity level this year. What do you think Nash?

[stevenash]

I think there probably wont be another Gus.  But maybe, just maybe, that staff over at HJ is just smart enough to figure out what to do next.  I know that there was never ever going to be another Bob Cousy but I like what Rondo is doing for the Celtics.

[indian15/16]

Nash keep the term "great" relative to basketball overall: region, state, various levels, not just your team, or their district. I respect your opinion, but you have to admit, good players can have great games.

[indian15/16]

[quote name="stevenash" post="976579" timestamp="1299177243"]
I think there probably wont be another Gus.  But maybe, just maybe, that staff over at HJ is just smart enough to figure out what to do next.  I know that there was never ever going to be another Bob Cousy but I like what Rondo is doing for the Celtics.
[/quote]No arguements there. I am about ready to proclaim Sutherland and his staff as "Elite Guru's" of the basketball world.

[Lazeek]

HJ has two more than capable players that can step up in the PG position.........Sophomore Braeden Harmon and Freshman Sammie Mitchell for the Hawks next season.  Not saying they will be Gus, but will be very good and effective!!!

[stevenash]

Its kind of interesting that after 3-a player of the year Ryan Donahoe left, it was the end.  What happened?  Jarvis Benard, another 3-a player of the year showed up.  Then, it was DEFINITELY the end.  But here comes Gus and he did such a great job the last couple of years.  Trying to figure out if it is just pure luck/coincidence or does somebody over at HJ know something that perhaps the rest of us dont?  Hmmmm

[stevenash]

[quote name="indian15/16" post="976580" timestamp="1299177279"]
Nash keep the term "great" relative to basketball overall: region, state, various levels, not just your team, or their district. I respect your opinion, but you have to admit, good players can have great games.
[/quote]

My point is that the word "great" is a relative term.  Let me put it another way- I think that if Shawn Prudhomme is not great, then there are no great players for Cleveland.  The thing I find comforting relative to the loss of Gus is the fact that Prudhomme, Person, and Bosha will all be better players next year thereby cushioning, to some degree, the loss of Gus.  By the way, as a sophomore, Gus made about 10 times the mistakes made by Bosha as a  freshman.

[stevenash]

[quote name="indian15/16" post="976580" timestamp="1299177279"]
Nash keep the term "great" relative to basketball overall: region, state, various levels, not just your team, or their district. I respect your opinion, but you have to admit, good players can have great games.
[/quote]

Agreed, but Prudhomme performed equally well against Stafford in an overtime game just a few nights before.  But, I guess he just happened to have two consecutive great games.  If you have many more than that, you just might be better than many think.

[BADSANTA]

DOWN GOES FRAZIER! AGAIN!

[indian15/16]

[quote name="stevenash" post="976611" timestamp="1299179500"]
[quote author=indian15/16 link=topic=81003.msg976580#msg976580 date=1299177279]
Nash keep the term "great" relative to basketball overall: region, state, various levels, not just your team, or their district. I respect your opinion, but you have to admit, good players can have great games.
[/quote]

Agreed, but Prudhomme performed equally well against Stafford in an overtime game just a few nights before.  But, I guess he just happened to have two consecutive great games.  If you have many more than that, you just might be better than many think.
[/quote]I'm not going to argue that he doesn't have the potential. Just don't think he's there, yet. IMO

[stevenash]

[quote name="indian15/16" post="976790" timestamp="1299188154"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=81003.msg976611#msg976611 date=1299179500]
[quote author=indian15/16 link=topic=81003.msg976580#msg976580 date=1299177279]
Nash keep the term "great" relative to basketball overall: region, state, various levels, not just your team, or their district. I respect your opinion, but you have to admit, good players can have great games.
[/quote]

Agreed, but Prudhomme performed equally well against Stafford in an overtime game just a few nights before.  But, I guess he just happened to have two consecutive great games.  If you have many more than that, you just might be better than many think.
[/quote]I'm not going to argue that he doesn't have the potential. Just don't think he's there, yet. IMO
[/quote]  No problem  You are entitled to your opinion and I respect that

[FanintheStands]

[quote name="indian15/16" post="976790" timestamp="1299188154"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=81003.msg976611#msg976611 date=1299179500]
[quote author=indian15/16 link=topic=81003.msg976580#msg976580 date=1299177279]
Nash keep the term "great" relative to basketball overall: region, state, various levels, not just your team, or their district. I respect your opinion, but you have to admit, good players can have great games.
[/quote]

Agreed, but Prudhomme performed equally well against Stafford in an overtime game just a few nights before.  But, I guess he just happened to have two consecutive great games.  If you have many more than that, you just might be better than many think.
[/quote]I'm not going to argue that he doesn't have the potential. Just don't think he's there, yet. IMO
[/quote]I think you are spot-on, here.  I've watched Shawn the last couple of years and I see improvement almost weekly...... so yes, there is still a lot of potential.

I wouldn't call him great, because that would imply he has peaked, which I seriously doubt.

[PoppaBearstarr]

[quote name="indian15/16" post="976499" timestamp="1299172035"]
Wow, as always some accurate takes and some misguided ones as well. First, congrats to HJ. I wish Coach Sutherland and the team all the best at regionals. Like it was stated, it's hard not to pull for those kids. I have to give my thoughts on the game last night. It was a compelling game and for the most part hard fought. These two teams are shadows of one another in many ways, but like in years past, the "management" of the teams was the deciding factor once again. The officiating was suspect at times but it always will be. That is just the human element. You can't be right all the time. Coach Sutherland can take decent talent with dedication and turn them into bonafied basketball players. Pruhomme has been talked up all year on this site and he is pretty good not great. His greatest talent is he just plays harder than most. What I'm trying to say is, he gets the most out of what he's got. The best player on that team is Gus. He makes every teamate better and able perform while he does the dirty work. The rest of the team will feel his absence next season big time. I hate to see this type of ending for the Indian seniors. My heart goes out to them, a large portion of their failures were not their fault. I will leave it at that. We have plenty of talent in waiting, our freshman class is legit. Cleveland will be back and maybe better than ever. Great season Indians! We love you guys. Agian, good luck to the Hawks.
[/quote]


Good post Indian 15/16, although I don't agree with all of your assessments it took a lot of courage to come on and eat a little crow. I thought your team played very hard last night & I thought that 24 left everything out on the court last night he is an amazing player. I hate to see any seniors season end that way, and my heart goes out for them. #12 is a special player as well, I hope 3 will end up playing college somewhere cause he can flat out shoot the rock. I do believe that the indians had a lot more athleticism than the hawks did on the floor, but I also felt that the Hawks had more Basketball talent on the floor, it made for a great game...

[bmrm]

[quote name="tigersvoice" post="976248" timestamp="1299162583"]
[quote author=bmrm link=topic=81003.msg975922#msg975922 date=1299120849]
[quote author=Bobcat05 link=topic=81003.msg975826#msg975826 date=1299119342]
[quote author=BADSANTA link=topic=78099.msg975150#msg975150 date=1299069283]
[b]HJ will join us on the sidelines tonight. This isn't the same Cleveland team that loses every year. The Indians will go to state. [/b] [/quote]


[/quote]

Can someone please help me follow BADSANTAS logic?  Months ago he couldn't stand HJ & then he couldn't praise HJ enough & predicted how bad HJ would beat Cleveland & now he's saying HJ will join his Silsbee Tigers on the sideline.  Obviously he is one to just jump on a bandwagon - I guess he is an HJ fan again.  Could this be the 3rd, 4th, 5th reincarnation of SWAG?    
[/quote]

I told you a long time ago that he's bipolar in a HUGE way! ::)
[/quote]

And now he's back on HJ's bandwagon - why does that not surprise me? 

[bmrm]

[quote name="hitchpin" post="976563" timestamp="1299176578"]
[quote author=stevenash link=topic=81003.msg976540#msg976540 date=1299174975]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=81003.msg976515#msg976515 date=1299173165]
yep cause hj gonna just flat run outta pg's when gus leaves ::)
[/quote]

Yeah, and HJ is having a down year, the talent pool is dry, and they will probably discontinue basketball.
[/quote]

nah, i hear bluedove is house shopping somewhere north and west  :o
[/quote]

Smart man!

[bmrm]

[quote name="indian15/16" post="976573" timestamp="1299176958"]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=81003.msg976515#msg976515 date=1299173165]
yep cause hj gonna just flat run outta pg's when gus leaves ::)
[/quote]Like Gus, absolutely, and don't even start with some garbage about Bosha. Gus's heir apparent was not on the court last night. Maybe they hid him at the sub varsity level this year. What do you think Nash?
[/quote]

Poor HJ - looks like their run is over. 

[FanintheStands]

[quote name="bmrm" post="977005" timestamp="1299203959"]
[quote author=indian15/16 link=topic=81003.msg976573#msg976573 date=1299176958]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=81003.msg976515#msg976515 date=1299173165]
yep cause hj gonna just flat run outta pg's when gus leaves ::)
[/quote]Like Gus, absolutely, and don't even start with some garbage about Bosha. Gus's heir apparent was not on the court last night. Maybe they hid him at the sub varsity level this year. What do you think Nash?
[/quote]

Poor HJ - looks like their run is over. 
[/quote]You know, once we find Gus's heir apparent, I don't anyone is going to toss out the "HJ is rebuilding" this year.

Just think.... Prudhomme, Persohn, Bosha, Carr.......    G'Lawd!!!!!!

[Lazeek]

PG next year will be Braeden Harmon and Sammie Mitchell!!!1

[bmrm]

[quote name="FanintheStands" post="977021" timestamp="1299204884"]
[quote author=bmrm link=topic=81003.msg977005#msg977005 date=1299203959]
[quote author=indian15/16 link=topic=81003.msg976573#msg976573 date=1299176958]
[quote author=speechless link=topic=81003.msg976515#msg976515 date=1299173165]
yep cause hj gonna just flat run outta pg's when gus leaves ::)
[/quote]Like Gus, absolutely, and don't even start with some garbage about Bosha. Gus's heir apparent was not on the court last night. Maybe they hid him at the sub varsity level this year. What do you think Nash?
[/quote]

Poor HJ - looks like their run is over. 
[/quote]You know, once we find Gus's heir apparent, I don't anyone is going to toss out the "HJ is rebuilding" this year.

Just think.... Prudhomme, Persohn, Bosha, Carr.......     G'Lawd!!!!!!

I'm hoping we can compete! 
[/quote]