Rank Kyle lowry please

[king]

Since he didnt get all star. Where do you rank him him western conference point guards?

[ForeverADog]

Behind Paul, Parker, Westbrook, at least. Then I put him in that next group.

[Honest Abe]

[quote name="ForeverADog" post="1175512" timestamp="1328899793"]
Behind Paul, Parker, Westbrook, at least. Then I put him in that next group.
[/quote]
That sounds fair. He is very good, but not yet elite like the others u listed. As much as he has improved though, I could see him reaching that elite level soon.

[Cowboysfaithful22]

Maybe behind Nash too. and Ricky Rubio of course lol ;)

[Guest beechnut]

Hes ok but cannot shoot now and plus he wines to much.

[east texas bb]

Man, people dont give Nash enough credit.  The dude averages 16-17 PPG and right at 11 assists=22 more points (league leader at the moment), shoots 50% from floor, 42% from 3 for career, and 93 percent from FT line, for his career.  He hardly ever takes a bad shot and still puts up these numbers. Only player to be a 180 shooter for his career.  35 years old.  6 or 7 on all time assists and will probably end up 2 or 3 when finished.

[king]

[quote name="beechnut" post="1177476" timestamp="1329193096"]
Hes ok but cannot shoot now and plus he wines to much.
[/quote] maybe cuz he has a sprained elbow..

[ForeverADog]

I put him with Nash. Nash hasn't been able to win enough to be in that top class.

[east texas bb]

Nash hasnt been able to win because he hasnt had anyone to help.  He had Amare for a little while and they went to conference finals two years, and some believe would have won it all if Donaguehy wouldnt havent cheated.  But think of all the players that Nash made relevant, Joe Johnson, Marion, Richardson, Amare to an extent (he hasnt been near as successful since leaving).
They have an article on the Internet showing stats of where these players were at and where they are now because of benifiting from playing with Nash.  Yall are crazy if you think Kyle LOwery is even close to Nash.  Nash is a top 3 PG right now at 35.  3and 4 years ago, he was the best in the NBA, 2 years in a row.

[Cowboysfaithful22]

[quote name="east texas bb" post="1178103" timestamp="1329274369"]
Nash hasnt been able to win because he hasnt had anyone to help.  He had Amare for a little while and they went to conference finals two years, and some believe would have won it all if Donaguehy wouldnt havent cheated.  But think of all the players that Nash made relevant, Joe Johnson, Marion, Richardson, Amare to an extent (he hasnt been near as successful since leaving).
They have an article on the Internet showing stats of where these players were at and where they are now because of benifiting from playing with Nash.  Yall are crazy if you think Kyle LOwery is even close to Nash.  [b]Nash is a top 3 PG right now at 35[/b].  3and 4 years ago, he was the best in the NBA, 2 years in a row.
[/quote]
Agreed with you up until that point. Please rank your top five

[east texas bb]

Top 5:  No particular order.
Chris Paul, Derrick Rose, Steve Nash, Derrin Williams, Russell Westbrook  ( at this time)
Nash is also 38 years old.  Check this site out, they have Nash at number 6 because of his defense, offensivly the best PG in the league.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/787436-nba-ranking-all-30-starting-point-guards#/articles/787436-nba-ranking-all-30-starting-point-guards/page/26

[east texas bb]

And Kyle Lowery is ranked 28 out of the 30 starting PG's.

[Cowboysfaithful22]

[quote name="east texas bb" post="1178220" timestamp="1329279146"]
Top 5:  No particular order.
Chris Paul, Derrick Rose, Steve Nash, Derrin Williams, Russell Westbrook  ( at this time)
Nash is also 38 years old.  Check this site out, they have Nash at number 6 because of his defense, offensivly the best PG in the league.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/787436-nba-ranking-all-30-starting-point-guards#/articles/787436-nba-ranking-all-30-starting-point-guards/page/26
[/quote]
I think six is a pretty good spot for him. I'd probably put Rondo ahead of him at this point in their careers. And they ranked these in August. That's why Lowry is so low

[east texas bb]

They put Rondo ahead of him, but Rondo's stats are no where near what Nash's are and Rondo plays way more minutes.  If you add Rondo's extra minutes to Nash's and Nash jumps to about 20 something PPG and 12-13 APG.  Nash is ranked 6th and gets the least amount of playing time because of his age and the long NBA season.  I would take Nash in the 4th over any other PG, although I like Chris Paul and Rose too.

[Cowboysfaithful22]

[quote name="east texas bb" post="1178449" timestamp="1329317792"]
They put Rondo ahead of him, but Rondo's stats are no where near what Nash's are and Rondo plays way more minutes.  If you add Rondo's extra minutes to Nash's and Nash jumps to about 20 something PPG and 12-13 APG.  Nash is ranked 6th and gets the least amount of playing time because of his age and the long NBA season.  I would take Nash in the 4th over any other PG, although I like Chris Paul and Rose too.
[/quote]
I think Rondo's defense is far more superior to than Nash's though. And Rondo is starting to come into his own on the offensive side of the ball. He's easily one of the best at penetrating and getting to the basket. Rondo's stats are a little skewed too because he's got the old big three on his team. Nash is the only offensive weapon on his.

[east texas bb]

Rondo is a great defender, I would pick him or Rose as the best PG defender. 
I think Rondo is aided in scoring by Allen, Garnett, and Pierce, his stats are higher than what they would be with another team.  That being said, he does get to the rim well (he has to) and he hustles hard, the old guys hurt him more on defense than anything.  His shooting percentages are what really hurt him.
Career Stats:  PPG 10  APG 7.7  RPB 4.4  SPG 1.9  Field Goal: 48%  3 Point: 23%  Free Throw:  62%  TO/PG:  2.7      Career MPG: 32

This year  11'/12':  PPG 14.1 APG: 9.8  RPG 4.9 SPG 1.9  TO/PG: 3.8      Minutes Per Game:  36.8
His shooting statistics are worse for this year than his career.

Steve Nash Career Stats:  PPG 14.8  APG: 8.9  SPG: .9  RPG:  3.0    TO/PG:  2.85  MPG: 31
FG:  50%  3 Point:  43%  FT: 91%  Only 1 of 2 players in NBA history to shoot this percentage for a career.  4 Seasons of of 50% field goal, 40% 3 Point, and 90% FT, more than any NBA player ever.
11'12' This year stats:  PPG 15  APG  11.4  SPG: .6  RPG:  2.6  To/PG: 3.5  MPG: 31 

If you adjust for 36 minutes the numbers go up considerably, more like his 06' and 07' seasons.  Nash is the one you could make the argument that has not been surrounded by alot of talent, he has had some but not much. 

[Cowboysfaithful22]

I agree that Nash has had a better career thus far. I'm just saying I would take rondo at this point. But the fact that he plays with the big three impresses me that he can put up 14 a game. At this point in all of their careers, they are offensive players with not much def left(except Garnett) but all of their main priorities are to score. So to me, when Rondo has usually been the 3rd to 4th option his whole career and Nash has been either 1st or 2nd in his, Rondo is better IMO. Not taking away from Nash cause I really do like the guy

[east texas bb]

I agree with alot of what you are saying. I think Rondo's depth on the scoring accountability list is due to him no being that great of a scoring and also because he was brought to the Celtics to feed those 3 and play defense.  14 or 15  is not alot in a NBA game, very average, but when you add 9 or 11 assists it makes a difference.  Where I would have to disagree is that Nash is the 1st or 2nd scoring option on his team, he leads the league in making plays for others to score and getting the ball to them to score, the illusion is that Nash makes just about all of his shots, it does not take him as many attempts to score 15 or 20 as it would others, so I would say that his shooting ability makes him look as a 1st or 2nd option but really is not.

[Cowboysfaithful22]

[quote name="east texas bb" post="1179371" timestamp="1329410839"]
I agree with alot of what you are saying. I think Rondo's depth on the scoring accountability list is due to him no being that great of a scoring and also because he was brought to the Celtics to feed those 3 and play defense.  14 or 15  is not alot in a NBA game, very average, but when you add 9 or 11 assists it makes a difference.  Where I would have to disagree is that Nash is the 1st or 2nd scoring option on his team, he leads the league in making plays for others to score and getting the ball to them to score, the illusion is that Nash makes just about all of his shots, it does not take him as many attempts to score 15 or 20 as it would others, so I would say that his shooting ability makes him look as a 1st or 2nd option but really is not.
[/quote]
But he's always made players around him better. I still think he's no lower than 2 on scoring priority on his Suns team now. And just a fun fact. . Rondo is the only guy to have multiple triple doubles this year ;)

[east texas bb]

Nash is probably the 2nd scoring option on this team, he has nobody this year, I almost feel sorry for him and dont understand how he leads the league in assists when he is surrounded with the current team, also he will always be a high scoring option because of his shooting percentage.  He averages 15-17 a game with a very select shot selection.  And Nash has always made players around him better and gotten them better contracts.  I wish I could find that article that showed the contracts and stats and fame that players had gotten before and after they played with Nash.  It was after the 06-07 seasons and alot of them left but Nash stayed, they got contracts almost double what they had previously had.
I have retained more respect for Rondo than I used to.  He is a very hard worker and hustles his tail off, has long long arms to be a guard, huge hands, and passes the ball well.  It is not hard to get a triple double in the NBA, they play 48 minute games so their stats are usually higher and in Rondo's case, he is a good rebounder to go with passer, so if he grabs 10 boards then he is going to have a triple double.  10 points is easy with the minutes they play and they are both great passes.
I just want people to think what Nash could have done if over the past 5 years he would have been on a team with a legit center and a couple of other good players.  The two years he had a decent supporting cast he got NBA MVP 2 years in a row.  That is something Rondo will never have.

[Cowboysfaithful22]

Rondo>Nash... today's game was sick! he was close to having a 20-20-20.

[king]

Rondo vs lowry tonight  :o

[Cowboysfaithful22]

[quote name="king" post="1193167" timestamp="1331051415"]
Rondo vs lowry tonight  :o
[/quote]
Poor lowry ;)

[king]

[quote name="Cowboysfaithful22" post="1193247" timestamp="1331055415"]
[quote author=king link=topic=95723.msg1193167#msg1193167 date=1331051415]
Rondo vs lowry tonight  :o
[/quote]
Poor lowry ;)
[/quote] he did really good against cp3 other night.

[Cowboysfaithful22]

[quote name="king" post="1193461" timestamp="1331076520"]
[quote author=Cowboysfaithful22 link=topic=95723.msg1193247#msg1193247 date=1331055415]
[quote author=king link=topic=95723.msg1193167#msg1193167 date=1331051415]
Rondo vs lowry tonight  :o
[/quote]
Poor lowry ;)
[/quote] he did really good against cp3 other night.
[/quote]
Wasn't TOO bad. Poor shooting percentage, but Rondo didn't have a good game either..