Orange County Coaching Records Since 1977!

[WOSgrad]

8 hours ago, purpleeagle said:

This is a Orange County Post, please do not bring up that Newton has 5 state championships and WO-S only has 4.

WO-S has been open since 1977......Newton has been playing football annually in a UIL district since 1944.

[Reagan]

9 minutes ago, WOSgrad said:

If you would bother to answer my question as to how many NFL or CFL players the other Orange County schools have produced, you'd know the answer to yours.

Trust me, yours is coming.  I just wanted to see other responses first. 

[LCMAlumtiger32]

29 minutes ago, Reagan said:

Trust me, yours is coming.  I just wanted to see other responses first. 

I wonder if you can count Earl Thomas he went to LCM to 9th grade. Then got recruited to WOS

[WOSgrad]

19 minutes ago, LC-M said:

I wonder if you can count Earl Thomas he went to LCM to 9th grade. Then got recruited to WOS

Attended elementary school and part of middle school in Orange.

[LCMAlumtiger32]

1 hour ago, Reagan said:

18 minutes ago, WOSgrad said:

 

Grad I’m just joking around. To be honest I’m just ready for football season to start. I could careless about winning percentages or who went to the nfl. I actually watch WOS in a season game and in the playoffs and when they go to the championship games. So yes I support WOS as a resident of orange and I think that’s how it should be. As of LCM they need improvement we have not had the talent That wos has. I think LCM could be a lot better maybe not state championship team but be more competitive on the field. I think Vidor and Bridge City has had special teams that have came through but they continue to have unsuccessful seasons.

[Bigdog]

On 7/6/2019 at 7:57 AM, purpleeagle said:

Looks like Monte has done pretty good to me. Co=Champions in a competitive district. They should put a sign at the city limits of Nederland saying, "Don't mess with the Barrow Bulldogs, you just might get bit'.  Keep up the good work Monte.

Barrow is 18-5 for the first two years.

[WOSgrad]

4 minutes ago, LC-M said:

 

LC-M, figured you were.  I would love to see every school in Orange County go far into the playoffs on a regular basis.  Believe me, I don't deny the fact that WO-S has has the fortune of having a series of great coaches since its opening and, yes, they have played a big part in the Mustangs' winning ways.  But as one of those 3 said, "You can't win the Kentucky Derby with a mule."  And by my posts, I don't mean to diminish that.  However, to talk about how great Mustang coaches are and imply that the rest of Orange County schools have trash as coaches is a slap in the face to excellent coaches in the county like Jeff Mathews, Josh Smalley, Allen DeShazo and while I know many disagree, Randy Crouch.  While Reagan seems all too willing to take that slap, I don't.

[LCMAlumtiger32]

5 minutes ago, WOSgrad said:

LC-M, figured you were.  I would love to see every school in Orange County go far into the playoffs on a regular basis.  Believe me, I don't deny the fact that WO-S has has the fortune of having a series of great coaches since its opening and, yes, they have played a big part in the Mustangs' winning ways.  But as one of those 3 said, "You can't win the Kentucky Derby with a mule."  And by my posts, I don't mean to diminish that.  However, to talk about how great Mustang coaches are and imply that the rest of Orange County schools have trash as coaches is a slap in the face to excellent coaches in the county like Jeff Mathews, Josh Smalley, Allen DeShazo and while I know many disagree, Randy Crouch.  While Reagan seems all too willing to take that slap, I don't.

I know you and maybe other folks think I’m anti Crouch. I know he got criticized at WOS a lot.   I think he’s a good guy but there’s things that have happened that I disagree with. I’m not gonna bash him on a open site. If you want to message me about it that’s fine. I’m sure he’s almost at retirement.

[WOSgrad]

21 minutes ago, LC-M said:

I know you and maybe other folks think I’m anti Crouch. I know he got criticized at WOS a lot.   I think he’s a good guy but there’s things that have happened that I disagree with. I’m not gonna bash him on a open site. If you want to message me about it that’s fine. I’m sure he’s almost at retirement.

No, it is not you.  There are a number of folks who do not frequent this board that I have heard from who have their criticisms of Coach Crouch.

[Reagan]

18 hours ago, Guitar Man said:

Honestly, the only fact that matters in this whole thread is that WO-S churns out raw talent better than any school in the area. There are alot of great coaches out there that will never have the talent that WO-S gets on a regular basis and their records reflect that in comparison to WO-S. Aside from good coaching, you gotta have the athletes, and equally as important, a community that backs their football program. Not to take away from their tremendous success, but compared to their present and past district opponents, WO-S rarely faces hard opposition until about 3 to 4 rounds deep. WO-S is blessed with athletes, great coaching, and a community that supports the team. That is what it takes to be successful, if you are missing any one of those three elements, your record will look like any of the schools that aren't WO-S in the article.       

There is a reason for this.  It happens in most is not every classification.

[Reagan]

On 7/6/2019 at 7:57 AM, purpleeagle said:

Looks like Monte has done pretty good to me. Co=Champions in a competitive district. They should put a sign at the city limits of Nederland saying, "Don't mess with the Barrow Bulldogs, you just might get bit'.  Keep up the good work Monte.

Curious for your opinion:  Why do you say it is?

[Reagan]

On 7/6/2019 at 9:49 PM, WOSgrad said:

Fair enough, then tell how many players the other Orange County schools have sent to the NFL or CFL since 1977?

 

The players you stated are excellent players, no doubt.  But, without being able to prove it, I have no doubt that any games these aforementioned players played in, WOS would have won with or without these players due to the coaching at WOS.  As for the any players that went to the NFL from the other Orange County schools, as you will see, it really doesn't matter when trying to win a State Championship.  Now, I’m sure there’s a possibility that the PN-G QB will play in the NFL.  He was one of the best, if not the best QB in the State. That didn’t help PN-G.  Jamaal Charles played in the NFL and it didn’t help Port Arthur.   Joe Washington and Bobby Leopold played in the NFL and it didn’t help Lincoln.  Cotton Speyrer played in the NFL and that didn’t help TJ.  Now, let’s look on the other side of the coin.  Look at Liberty Hill this year, I guess it’s possible, but I doubt there’ll be any NFL players coming from that bunch.  They won State because they were well coached.  Now, a little earlier:  PN-G, 1975, coached by Doug Ethridge, won the State Championship with no NFL players (none I can recall).  The next year PN-G played in the State Championship game again with no NFL players.  The previous state champion from PN-G was in 1955.  So, it took 20 years for another one.  Now, this went through the 60’s.  What – no talent in the 60’s?  Well, let’s see.  They had Greg Davis, Wade Phillips, Tommy Landry and Mike Simpson -- who did play in the NFL.  But nothing happened during the 60’s of any consequence.  Let’s move into the 70’s.  1971, 72, and 73, PN-G had a RB by the name of Jeff “The Jet” Bergeron.  In 1972 and 73, he was one of the best, if not the best, RB in the State of Texas.  In 1972, PN-G led the State in rushing.  Nothing – they stayed home.  3 years later, Doug Ethridge was making a strong push to the State Championship.  4 years later PN-G won the State Championship.  Previous to this, Ethridge won a State Championship at Hobbs, NM.  Don’t know for a fact, but I also doubt there were any players that made it to the NFL from that team.  So, the point is:  although it doesn’t hurt, having these quality players you talked about isn’t totally necessary to get to Big Dance.  But good coaching sure is!

[LCMAlumtiger32]

9 hours ago, WOSgrad said:

 

 

25 minutes ago, Reagan said:

The players you stated are excellent players, no doubt.  But, without being able to prove it, I have no doubt that any games these aforementioned players played in, WOS would have won with or without these players due to the coaching at WOS.  As for the any players that went to the NFL from the other Orange County schools, as you will see, it really doesn't matter when trying to win a State Championship.  Now, I’m sure there’s a possibility that the PN-G QB will play in the NFL.  He was one of the best, if not the best QB in the State. That didn’t help PN-G.  Jamaal Charles played in the NFL and it didn’t help Port Arthur.   Joe Washington and Bobby Leopold played in the NFL and it didn’t help Lincoln.  Cotton Speyrer played in the NFL and that didn’t help TJ.  Now, let’s look on the other side of the coin.  Look at Liberty Hill this year, I guess it’s possible, but I doubt there’ll be any NFL players coming from that bunch.  They won State because they were well coached.  Now, a little earlier:  PN-G, 1975, coached by Doug Ethridge, won the State Championship with no NFL players (none I can recall).  The next year PN-G played in the State Championship game again with no NFL players.  The previous state champion from PN-G was in 1955.  So, it took 20 years for another one.  Now, this went through the 60’s.  What – no talent in the 60’s?  Well, let’s see.  They had Greg Davis, Wade Phillips, Tommy Landry and Mike Simpson -- who did play in the NFL.  But nothing happened during the 60’s of any consequence.  Let’s move into the 70’s.  1971, 72, and 73, PN-G had a RB by the name of Jeff “The Jet” Bergeron.  In 1972 and 73, he was one of the best, if not the best, RB in the State of Texas.  In 1972, PN-G led the State in rushing.  Nothing – they stayed home.  3 years later, Doug Ethridge was making a strong push to the State Championship.  4 years later PN-G won the State Championship.  Previous to this, Ethridge won a State Championship at Hobbs, NM.  Don’t know for a fact, but I also doubt there were any players that made it to the NFL from that team.  So, the point is:  although it doesn’t hurt, having these quality players you talked about isn’t totally necessary to get to Big Dance.  But good coaching sure is!

Well Bridge City had 3 go in the pros but only one won state championship. 

[WOSgrad]

7 hours ago, LC-M said:

 

Well Bridge City had 3 go in the pros but only one won state championship. 

Too bad it took for you to answer the question that Reagan wouldn't.

Reagan's response not only doesn't bother to answer my question.  The suggestion that a team can bring home a state championship with mediocre players is laughable.

[LCMAlumtiger32]

32 minutes ago, WOSgrad said:

Too bad it took for you to answer the question that Reagan wouldn't.

Reagan's response not only doesn't bother to answer my question.  The suggestion that a team can bring home a state championship with mediocre players is laughable.

To my knowledge no one from LCM has played in the NFL. I think we had one that entered the draft this year but didn’t get picked up. I know we had kids go to D1 schools just never got passed that point. I think Reagan is trying to say a undersized athlete at the highschool level can be talented enough to win state championship but never have the size to make it the pros? I remember Lagrange had D1 running back Dobbins I believe. WOS defense was all over him and I think he got hurt in the 2n quarter. You can’t just have one stud and beat WOS. That’s why teams in our area have had trouble with WOS. 

[CardinalBacker]

1 hour ago, WOSgrad said:

Too bad it took for you to answer the question that Reagan wouldn't.

Reagan's response not only doesn't bother to answer my question.  The suggestion that a team can bring home a state championship with mediocre players is laughable.

It's also laughable to think that someone could assemble the most athletically talented group of kids and championships are guaranteed.  

 

 

[WOSgrad]

39 minutes ago, CardinalBacker said:

It's also laughable to think that someone could assemble the most athletically talented group of kids and championships are guaranteed.  

 

 

Didn't say that.  But to totally dismiss the quality of the players that you have in a quest for a state title is a bit silly.  It appears that Reagan is doing just that.

[Mr. Buddy Garrity]

9 hours ago, Reagan said:

The players you stated are excellent players, no doubt.  But, without being able to prove it, I have no doubt that any games these aforementioned players played in, WOS would have won with or without these players due to the coaching at WOS.  As for the any players that went to the NFL from the other Orange County schools, as you will see, it really doesn't matter when trying to win a State Championship.  Now, I’m sure there’s a possibility that the PN-G QB will play in the NFL.  He was one of the best, if not the best QB in the State. That didn’t help PN-G.  Jamaal Charles played in the NFL and it didn’t help Port Arthur.   Joe Washington and Bobby Leopold played in the NFL and it didn’t help Lincoln.  Cotton Speyrer played in the NFL and that didn’t help TJ.  Now, let’s look on the other side of the coin.  Look at Liberty Hill this year, I guess it’s possible, but I doubt there’ll be any NFL players coming from that bunch.  They won State because they were well coached.  Now, a little earlier:  PN-G, 1975, coached by Doug Ethridge, won the State Championship with no NFL players (none I can recall).  The next year PN-G played in the State Championship game again with no NFL players.  The previous state champion from PN-G was in 1955.  So, it took 20 years for another one.  Now, this went through the 60’s.  What – no talent in the 60’s?  Well, let’s see.  They had Greg Davis, Wade Phillips, Tommy Landry and Mike Simpson -- who did play in the NFL.  But nothing happened during the 60’s of any consequence.  Let’s move into the 70’s.  1971, 72, and 73, PN-G had a RB by the name of Jeff “The Jet” Bergeron.  In 1972 and 73, he was one of the best, if not the best, RB in the State of Texas.  In 1972, PN-G led the State in rushing.  Nothing – they stayed home.  3 years later, Doug Ethridge was making a strong push to the State Championship.  4 years later PN-G won the State Championship.  Previous to this, Ethridge won a State Championship at Hobbs, NM.  Don’t know for a fact, but I also doubt there were any players that made it to the NFL from that team.  So, the point is:  although it doesn’t hurt, having these quality players you talked about isn’t totally necessary to get to Big Dance.  But good coaching sure is!

What the hell are you talking about?  Do I need to add you to my overcrowded ignore list too?  Good grief. 

[Guitar Man]

Reagan it's simple. If Orangefield, BC, LCM, Vidor, or any other Orange County school had the consistent number of high caliber athletes rolling through, they would see consistent success like WOS does. Like I said before, there are three main aspects to a consistently successful team. Talent, Good coaching and a community who supports the football team. You wanted to bring up history and made the focus on coaches. You cannot do that, because you leave the other factors out. Teams that have little talent and awesome coaching are usually mediocre. Teams with good athletes and bad coaching are mediocre. When you put it all together, good players that are well coached will win consistently. Yeah, there will be years where a good group will come through a usual mediocre school and make a deep run but when it comes to consistency, there is no arguement against taking into account all factors. I believe most coaching records reflect the consistent lack of athletes, or a community that has little support for their team.

[purpleeagle]

Good Athletes are developed from early age, starts with pee wee football and goes up. Of course we all know that coaching has nothing to do with developing these kid.. They are self taught through sand lot football. Coaches like Cornell or W.T. and Barrow have nothing to do with their success. They are just lucky enough to have these self taught kids come their way.

[Austin1985]

Shouldn't this be a head to head comparison with Newton?  Other than that, there's not a school in a 100 mile radius since '77 that can compare.  Possibly Jack Yates but that's about it....

[WOSgrad]

2 hours ago, purpleeagle said:

Good Athletes are developed from early age, starts with pee wee football and goes up. Of course we all know that coaching has nothing to do with developing these kid.. They are self taught through sand lot football. Coaches like Cornell or W.T. and Barrow have nothing to do with their success. They are just lucky enough to have these self taught kids come their way.

Nobody wishes to diminish the role of a coach in a championship team....I know I don't.  By the same token, the role of talented players or the community support shouldn't be diminished either.  Who thinks so?  Cornel Thompson, who on regional television uttered the now famous, "You can't win the Kentucky Derby with a mule."  And W.T. Johnson, God rest his soul, who just a couple of years later on the very same regional network, gave the impassioned post game interview as so how it just plain different in Newton, Texas.

They are two men who work around the clock, training and motivating their kids, attending conferences how to get even better than they were.  But there is so much a coach can do.  A coach has only so much clay to mold.  Curtis Barbay went 24 years between the Eagles' first title in 1974 and their second in 1998. Dan Hooks and Thompson went 29 years the Mustangs' 2nd and third state titles. Same coaches, same training techniques.  Is someone trying to imply that in those periods of time the these men, Hall of Fame coaches all, were out coached during those droughts?

It may not occur to some, but this area is blessed a number of coaches like Monte Barrow.  They have hard working and talented players.

But ask yourself this and be honest.....can anybody here recall a team who you think should have had a deep playoff run that didn't because they underachieved due to coaching?

[purpleeagle]

Coaching has everything to do with winning. Good coaches put in programs and bring these kids alone from jr. high on up. Some years they have better athletes then other years. The coaches have to get the kids to buy into the program. Kids who don't work in the summer with weights and conditioning do not fit into programs like Newton, WO-S, etc. Look what happen to Navasota, coach left, team went down hill. The new coach is having to rebuild the program. Kirbyville is another school that has hit the bottom, they have plenty of good kids but the leadership has left. Cornell could take that  team over and have them winning in a few years. Anahuac has a new coach but it will take a few years for Neece to build that program up.  

[Guitar Man]

32 minutes ago, purpleeagle said:

Coaching has everything to do with winning. Good coaches put in programs and bring these kids alone from jr. high on up. Some years they have better athletes then other years. The coaches have to get the kids to buy into the program. Kids who don't work in the summer with weights and conditioning do not fit into programs like Newton, WO-S, etc. Look what happen to Navasota, coach left, team went down hill. The new coach is having to rebuild the program. Kirbyville is another school that has hit the bottom, they have plenty of good kids but the leadership has left. Cornell could take that  team over and have them winning in a few years. Anahuac has a new coach but it will take a few years for Neece to build that program up.  

I agree and love your thought that good coaches could develop athletes to become better with a good off-season programs and getting kids to buy in the program, but let's be honest about something. In terms of consistency, The number of talented young men is something you cannot control as a coach. We have several great coaches that do their best with what they are given talent wise. Regardless of who the coach is, you got to have the athletes to go out there and put points on the board or play defense. Some people do not understand how many variables go into a successful program. Most schools have a great coach to lead them, but the talent caliber of a WOS or a Newton just is not there. Reagan wants to focus on coaching records, but does not realize behind a stellar coaching records is tremendous players, awesome coaching, and communities that drop everything to be at the game on Friday night. That is the culture that needs to be in place.  

[Reagan]

7 hours ago, Mr. Buddy Garrity said:

What the hell are you talking about?  Do I need to add you to my overcrowded ignore list too?  Good grief. 

Ignore at your own parole!  LOL!  You need to pay more attention to what's going on.  WOS, as well as others, understands the topic!