Jump to content

High School Refs


Recommended Posts

Tonight it finally came to a head for me. PNG suffered a devastating injury to one of their players will fighting for a rebound. We are not sure the extent of the injury at this time, but it was clear that her feet got completely taken out from underneath her and she fell on her arm without being able to brace herself from the fall. This was with 3:30 left in the game. Now for the ref part, this injury was due to the refs not taking control of the game, this game was poorly officiated and the physicality of the game was allowed at an extreme level. This has gone on for way to long now and it needs to stop before more injuries happen. The refs need to start calling the game the way it is suppose to be called. Watch the college game and the lack of physicality, because the refs call the game the right way! Sorry if this makes no sense because I am fuming mad right now! 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First off, I hope the young lady will be ok and has a very speedy and successful recovery from injury.

Secondly, I had a long post typed in on this but deleted it. I will limit it to these points

1) The potential for injury from a poorly controlled game environment from an officiating perspective is what frightens me the most as the parent of a girl basketball player. 

2) There tends to be an overall apathy towards the fact that the girl's game is allowed to be played at an extremely physical level a lot of the times.

3) I believe this is largely done to keep the games at a "manageable" time frame, because of the fundamental overall lack of skilled players on a large number of high school teams' rosters.

4) The product that Refs calling UIL based games deliver should be like getting a Big Mac from McDonalds, i.e. the SAME no matter which one you go to (anywhere in the country), not all over the place in terms of how they call it. 

5) Two refs on the court for Varsity level play is not enough, there needs to be three. The extracurricular stuff that always escalates does so much more in two ref games as opposed to three ref games.

As with all my posts, they are my opinion. My comments are made with the intent to initiate a healthy discussion on a topic that needs to be addressed. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My comments are from a pissed off parent who is tired of crappy refs not controlling the games and creating a greater risk for injury.

How come the boys games get the top ref crews in the area? Somebody please explain this too me.

Why does a Varsity game on a Tuesday night last 2 hours, but tournaments continually schedule games an hour and 10 minutes apart?

The way a ref crew calls a game is a HUGE factor in the outcome of the game more times than not when they just refuse to call the game properly!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Mean Machine said:

First off, I hope the young lady will be ok and has a very speedy and successful recovery from injury.

Secondly, I had a long post typed in on this but deleted it. I will limit it to these points

1) The potential for injury from a poorly controlled game environment from an officiating perspective is what frightens me the most as the parent of a girl basketball player. 

2) There tends to be an overall apathy towards the fact that the girl's game is allowed to be played at an extremely physical level a lot of the times.

3) I believe this is largely done to keep the games at a "manageable" time frame, because of the fundamental overall lack of skilled players on a large number of high school teams' rosters.

4) The product that Refs calling UIL based games deliver should be like getting a Big Mac from McDonalds, i.e. the SAME no matter which one you go to (anywhere in the country), not all over the place in terms of how they call it. 

5) Two refs on the court for Varsity level play is not enough, there needs to be three. The extracurricular stuff that always escalates does so much more in two ref games as opposed to three ref games.

As with all my posts, they are my opinion. My comments are made with the intent to initiate a healthy discussion on a topic that needs to be addressed. 

 

 

7 hours ago, OneChance said:

My comments are from a pissed off parent who is tired of crappy refs not controlling the games and creating a greater risk for injury.

How come the boys games get the top ref crews in the area? Somebody please explain this too me.

Why does a Varsity game on a Tuesday night last 2 hours, but tournaments continually schedule games an hour and 10 minutes apart?

The way a ref crew calls a game is a HUGE factor in the outcome of the game more times than not when they just refuse to call the game properly!

Many of our teams just finished their last tournaments of the year this week.  They should see better officiating the remainder of their seasons.  It all boils down to trying to keep the tournaments on schedule.  The more whistles they blow, the longer the game.  Last night in our championship game, there were a lot of calls that were not made for the sake of time.  Our girls can be physical with anybody but we are also good at knocking down free throws as well as we have some depth on our bench if someone does get into foul trouble. 

As me and my freshman daughter sat last night and watched the game, I told her that tournament basketball is more physical and that she has to play through contact that would normally be called a foul in a district game.  She normally plays PG/SG for her team.  Should it be this way that I have to educate my daughter about this when it comes to basketball?  No it shouldn't but it is...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I educated my daughter about tournament reffing along time ago, but I cringe and hold my breath every time my kid drives to the basket. District play to me still isn’t good enough.

I hear fans say all the time, “Holy cow the girls basketball games are way more physical than the boys games!”

I understand the level of play and basketball iq in the boys game is higher, so what that means is the girls game should be officiated way tougher to take some of this crap away from the game. If a defender is riding on the PG’s hip all the way down the court, the foul should get called when it initially happens on the opposite side of the court, not when getting to the hole and getting knocked down. 

This has been a problem of mine for a long time. Basketball is basketball whether it is youth basketball or NBA basketball, and a foul is a foul no matter what level.

I could be crazy, but sometimes it feels like the refs pick and choose and say “That girl knows how to play so she knows better so I’ll call a foul on her, that girl isn’t a very good player and she probably doesn’t understand the game as much so I won’t call anything on her!”

I am still livid about this, PNG is 3-0 in district about to play against PAM and BH and we will now be without two key players now due to injuries. One was non contact and had nothing to do with refs, but this last one could have been prevented, then to add insult to injury, literally no foul was called and possession was given to the other team after ambulance arrived to take her to hospital.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, OneChance said:

I educated my daughter about tournament reffing along time ago, but I cringe and hold my breath every time my kid drives to the basket. District play to me still isn’t good enough.

I hear fans say all the time, “Holy cow the girls basketball games are way more physical than the boys games!”

I understand the level of play and basketball iq in the boys game is higher, so what that means is the girls game should be officiated way tougher to take some of this crap away from the game. If a defender is riding on the PG’s hip all the way down the court, the foul should get called when it initially happens on the opposite side of the court, not when getting to the hole and getting knocked down. 

This has been a problem of mine for a long time. Basketball is basketball whether it is youth basketball or NBA basketball, and a foul is a foul no matter what level.

I could be crazy, but sometimes it feels like the refs pick and choose and say “That girl knows how to play so she knows better so I’ll call a foul on her, that girl isn’t a very good player and she probably doesn’t understand the game as much so I won’t call anything on her!”

I am still livid about this, PNG is 3-0 in district about to play against PAM and BH and we will now be without two key players now due to injuries. One was non contact and had nothing to do with refs, but this last one could have been prevented, then to add insult to injury, literally no foul was called and possession was given to the other team after ambulance arrived to take her to hospital.

This is true prime example the pam vs vidor  last week. Julia had 3 people on her back the whole game but as soon as she gets a little aggressive the whistle gets blown.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As a coach, all you can do is

1.go to tournaments that allot enough time between games where they arent rushed.

2. Play against quality teams that “know how to play” so that the games dont resemble rugby bu players that are unskilled.

3. Teach kids how to negate that type of contact so that it does not become an issue.

Been there, done that... I fee your pain, but do t necessarily put it at the officials feet.  People that put on tournaments need three man crews, but alot of coaches use tournaments as fundraisers instead of a chance to compete and dont want to pay the extra money.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/30/2018 at 0:17 AM, OneChance said:

My comments are from a pissed off parent who is tired of crappy refs not controlling the games and creating a greater risk for injury.

How come the boys games get the top ref crews in the area? Somebody please explain this too me.

Why does a Varsity game on a Tuesday night last 2 hours, but tournaments continually schedule games an hour and 10 minutes apart?

The way a ref crew calls a game is a HUGE factor in the outcome of the game more times than not when they just refuse to call the game properly!

Simple. The boys games draw more fans therefore there is more ticket sales therefore more of a percentage of the gate for the officials. Economics

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Honestly, I might prefer such officiating in the girls’ games.  (But certainly don’t want anyone hurt obviously.)   Not that there aren’t some that play at a high level.  My wife has long contended that if you played a drinking game at most girls’ games where you had to take a shot anytime there was a foul, jump ball, or a girl hits the floor, no one would make it to halftime without dying of alcohol poisoning.   There are exceptions to the rule but when you are used to watching the boys’ game, most of these I see seem like one long whistle.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

 

5 minutes ago, TxHoops said:

Honestly, I might prefer such officiating in the girls’ games.  (But certainly don’t want anyone hurt obviously.)   Not that there aren’t some that play at a high level.  My wife has long contended that if you played a drinking game at most girls’ games where you had to take a shot anytime there was a foul, jump ball, or a girl hits the floor, no one would make it to halftime without dying of alcohol poisoning.   There are exceptions to the rule but when you are used to watching the boys’ game, most of these I see seem like one long whistle.  

I mentioned that above, that the lack of skill at a typical girls high school game makes the game hard to watch and harder to officiate. My daughter is fortunate to play with a great aau organization and watching one of those games versus a typical high school game is unbelievable. To use your analogy, if you watched one of her aau games, maybe you would leave with only a slight buzz, lol.

The main problem I have is that when the refs allow the overly physical play, it takes away what the skilled player (typically one who has spent many hours doing individual training, etc.) has worked on typically for their aau team. The lesser player in affect is rewarded for not being as good the skilled player. Just kind of frustrating.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, AggiesAreWe said:

Simple. The boys games draw more fans therefore there is more ticket sales therefore more of a percentage of the gate for the officials. Economics

Intresting, I did not know that.

Tournament and game was a three person crew.

Now that I have cooled down a little and talking to friends. I guess what irritates me the most is the inconsistency from one quarter to the next. One half to the next.

The particular game where player was hurt started off like any other game, refs called normal and missed calls like normal, then you could feel the fans starting to get excited the play started getting more and more physical the more excited the fans became, but the as the energy in the gym and the physicality of the game increased the refs whistles decreased. Almost like the refs started watching the game instead of reffing the game, this to me is where the refs have to step in and get control the game. You don’t want to take the energy out of the gym, but you can’t allow it to get out of hand and allow the potential for injury to happen. Don’t get me wrong here, this injury was an accident and may have still happened with the best refs in the world. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was informed by a person I know that per UIL rules, refs get paid flat rate plus flat rate travel, depending on distance. The days of percentage of the gate are done. UIL does not assign officials, the local chapters do.

This is the hidden content, please

Looks like boys or girls game pays the same. It may be that some refs are "above" reffing girls games, and don't want to ref girls games because the games are slower, more boring, etc.

So if someone says they getting part of the gate, that is not legal per UIL rules, according to the person I know. They used to do it that way, but UIL stepped in and changed it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 hours ago, AggiesAreWe said:

Simple. The boys games draw more fans therefore there is more ticket sales therefore more of a percentage of the gate for the officials. Economics

 

21 hours ago, AggiesAreWe said:

A flat fee then a percentage of gate.

Incorrect. Officials are paid a flat fee for each level they are officiating, then a one time travel fee. Basketball officials do not get any percentage of the gate fee. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Mean Machine said:

I was informed by a person I know that per UIL rules, refs get paid flat rate plus flat rate travel, depending on distance. The days of percentage of the gate are done. UIL does not assign officials, the local chapters do.

This is the hidden content, please

Looks like boys or girls game pays the same. It may be that some refs are "above" reffing girls games, and don't want to ref girls games because the games are slower, more boring, etc.

So if someone says they getting part of the gate, that is not legal per UIL rules, according to the person I know. They used to do it that way, but UIL stepped in and changed it.

I stand corrected. I thought they still got a percentage of gate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think it probably was changed due to the inequities that could arise from refs that got the "good" games when others did not maybe get the opportunity as much. 

Boys game and girls game the ref can make the same money, so that seems ok. Boys game definitely faster paced, girls game slower, maybe you don't have to run as much, but you in theory blow the whistle more, lol.

One more thought then I'm done with this topic. If the girls game got a larger percentage of the "better" refs who call the game by the book, then in theory wouldn't the girls game have a better chance to improve over time because it would take away the crutch of the coach being able to use overt physicality as a strategy, and make the coach have the girls work on skill and technique more in practices?  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So back to my question, why do the boys games get the better officiating?

Let me be clear, this officiating crew in this particular game was not the worst crew I have ever seen, it was just the icing on the cake for me, because my greatest fear for the girls finally happened. I just bit my tongue and couldn’t bite it anymore after seeing that. (On a positive note, the injured girl had a severe dislocation of the radial bone at the elbow, and should make a fairly quick recovery. There is some nerve damage involved so does have to PT).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Mean Machine said:

I think it probably was changed due to the inequities that could arise from refs that got the "good" games when others did not maybe get the opportunity as much. 

Boys game and girls game the ref can make the same money, so that seems ok. Boys game definitely faster paced, girls game slower, maybe you don't have to run as much, but you in theory blow the whistle more, lol.

One more thought then I'm done with this topic. If the girls game got a larger percentage of the "better" refs who call the game by the book, then in theory wouldn't the girls game have a better chance to improve over time because it would take away the crutch of the coach being able to use overt physicality as a strategy, and make the coach have the girls work on skill and technique more in practices?  

Amen, this I guess is where I am going with part of this. Bad officiating to me punishes the more skilled players, due to the unskilled just playing street (Gorilla) ball and not getting called for it, force these coaches to teach players a more fundamental game.

I hear it over and over by people that come and watch a girls game for the first time, “Geez, girls basketball is brutal, these refs don’t call anything!”

I want to also say, I understand officiating is very difficult and they are not going to see every foul, double dribble, carry and travel. I just wish they would try and eliminate the physicality of the game. And yes, lol, this would help PNG’s game, but I truly and honestly just want to try and protect the girls from injuries that maybe could have been prevented. All I have to say on this subject as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Member Statistics

    45,311
    Total Members
    1,837
    Most Online
    asher
    Newest Member
    asher
    Joined
  • Posts

    • Royal Jordanian Airlines Cancellation Policy Royal Jordanian Airlines provides passengers with the flexibility to cancel their flights under certain conditions. **1- The cancellation policy varies based on factors such as fare type, ticket conditions, and timing of cancellation. **2. Royal Jordanian Airlines Flight Cancellation Policy:** - Passengers can cancel their Royal Jordanian Airlines flights and receive a full refund if the cancellation is made within 24 hours of booking, provided the reservation was made at least two days before the scheduled departure. - After the 24-hour grace period, cancellation fees may apply depending on the fare type and ticket rules. **3. Royal Jordanian Airlines Main Cabin Cancellation Policy:** - Travelers holding tickets in the Main Cabin are subject to the standard cancellation policy set by Royal Jordanian Airlines . - Cancellation fees may vary depending on factors such as the timing of cancellation and the fare rules associated with the ticket. **4. Royal Jordanian Airlines Cancellation Policy for Basic Economy:** - Basic Economy fares typically come with more restrictive cancellation terms compared to other fare classes. - Passengers with Basic Economy tickets may face higher cancellation fees or may not be eligible for refunds, depending on the fare rules. **5. Understanding Royal Jordanian Airlines Cancellation Policy:** - It’s essential for passengers to review the fare rules and terms and conditions associated with their tickets before canceling a flight. - Passengers uncertain about their travel plans may want to consider purchasing refundable tickets or travel insurance for added flexibility. **6. What Is Royal Jordanian Airlines Cancellation Policy for Basic Economy?** - Passengers holding Basic Economy tickets should carefully review the specific cancellation terms and conditions outlined by Royal Jordanian Airlines . - They should be aware of any applicable fees or restrictions before proceeding with flight cancellation. **7. Contact Royal Jordanian Airlines for Assistance:** - Passengers needing assistance with canceling their flights or clarifying the cancellation policy can reach out to Royal Jordanian Airlines ‘ customer service for personalized support and guidance. **Conclusion:** - Familiarizing yourself with Royal Jordanian Airlines cancellation policy and understanding the terms associated with your fare type can help you navigate changes to your travel plans effectively. - Stay informed about any updates or revisions to the cancellation policy to ensure a smooth and hassle-free travel experience. Safe travels!
    • Royal Air Maroc Airlines Cancellation Policy Royal Air Maroc Airlines provides passengers with the flexibility to cancel their flights under certain conditions. **1- The cancellation policy varies based on factors such as fare type, ticket conditions, and timing of cancellation. **2. Royal Air Maroc Airlines Flight Cancellation Policy:** - Passengers can cancel their Royal Air Maroc Airlines flights and receive a full refund if the cancellation is made within 24 hours of booking, provided the reservation was made at least two days before the scheduled departure. - After the 24-hour grace period, cancellation fees may apply depending on the fare type and ticket rules. **3. Royal Air Maroc Airlines Main Cabin Cancellation Policy:** - Travelers holding tickets in the Main Cabin are subject to the standard cancellation policy set by Royal Air Maroc Airlines . - Cancellation fees may vary depending on factors such as the timing of cancellation and the fare rules associated with the ticket. **4. Royal Air Maroc Airlines Cancellation Policy for Basic Economy:** - Basic Economy fares typically come with more restrictive cancellation terms compared to other fare classes. - Passengers with Basic Economy tickets may face higher cancellation fees or may not be eligible for refunds, depending on the fare rules. **5. Understanding Royal Air Maroc Airlines Cancellation Policy:** - It’s essential for passengers to review the fare rules and terms and conditions associated with their tickets before canceling a flight. - Passengers uncertain about their travel plans may want to consider purchasing refundable tickets or travel insurance for added flexibility. **6. What Is Royal Air Maroc Airlines Cancellation Policy for Basic Economy?** - Passengers holding Basic Economy tickets should carefully review the specific cancellation terms and conditions outlined by Royal Air Maroc Airlines . - They should be aware of any applicable fees or restrictions before proceeding with flight cancellation. **7. Contact Royal Air Maroc Airlines for Assistance:** - Passengers needing assistance with canceling their flights or clarifying the cancellation policy can reach out to Royal Air Maroc Airlines ‘ customer service for personalized support and guidance. **Conclusion:** - Familiarizing yourself with Royal Air Maroc Airlines cancellation policy and understanding the terms associated with your fare type can help you navigate changes to your travel plans effectively. - Stay informed about any updates or revisions to the cancellation policy to ensure a smooth and hassle-free travel experience. Safe travels!
    • Qantas Airlines Cancellation Policy Qantas Airlines provides passengers with the flexibility to cancel their flights under certain conditions. **1- The cancellation policy varies based on factors such as fare type, ticket conditions, and timing of cancellation. **2. Qantas Airlines Flight Cancellation Policy:** - Passengers can cancel their Qantas Airlines flights and receive a full refund if the cancellation is made within 24 hours of booking, provided the reservation was made at least two days before the scheduled departure. - After the 24-hour grace period, cancellation fees may apply depending on the fare type and ticket rules. **3. Qantas Airlines Main Cabin Cancellation Policy:** - Travelers holding tickets in the Main Cabin are subject to the standard cancellation policy set by Qantas Airlines . - Cancellation fees may vary depending on factors such as the timing of cancellation and the fare rules associated with the ticket. **4. Qantas Airlines Cancellation Policy for Basic Economy:** - Basic Economy fares typically come with more restrictive cancellation terms compared to other fare classes. - Passengers with Basic Economy tickets may face higher cancellation fees or may not be eligible for refunds, depending on the fare rules. **5. Understanding Qantas Airlines Cancellation Policy:** - It’s essential for passengers to review the fare rules and terms and conditions associated with their tickets before canceling a flight. - Passengers uncertain about their travel plans may want to consider purchasing refundable tickets or travel insurance for added flexibility. **6. What Is Qantas Airlines Cancellation Policy for Basic Economy?** - Passengers holding Basic Economy tickets should carefully review the specific cancellation terms and conditions outlined by Qantas Airlines . - They should be aware of any applicable fees or restrictions before proceeding with flight cancellation. **7. Contact Qantas Airlines for Assistance:** - Passengers needing assistance with canceling their flights or clarifying the cancellation policy can reach out to Qantas Airlines ‘ customer service for personalized support and guidance. **Conclusion:** - Familiarizing yourself with Qantas Airlines cancellation policy and understanding the terms associated with your fare type can help you navigate changes to your travel plans effectively. - Stay informed about any updates or revisions to the cancellation policy to ensure a smooth and hassle-free travel experience. Safe travels!
    • Philippines Airlines Cancellation Policy Philippines Airlines provides passengers with the flexibility to cancel their flights under certain conditions. **1- The cancellation policy varies based on factors such as fare type, ticket conditions, and timing of cancellation. **2. Philippines Airlines Flight Cancellation Policy:** - Passengers can cancel their Philippines Airlines flights and receive a full refund if the cancellation is made within 24 hours of booking, provided the reservation was made at least two days before the scheduled departure. - After the 24-hour grace period, cancellation fees may apply depending on the fare type and ticket rules. **3. Philippines Airlines Main Cabin Cancellation Policy:** - Travelers holding tickets in the Main Cabin are subject to the standard cancellation policy set by Philippines Airlines . - Cancellation fees may vary depending on factors such as the timing of cancellation and the fare rules associated with the ticket. **4. Philippines Airlines Cancellation Policy for Basic Economy:** - Basic Economy fares typically come with more restrictive cancellation terms compared to other fare classes. - Passengers with Basic Economy tickets may face higher cancellation fees or may not be eligible for refunds, depending on the fare rules. **5. Understanding Philippines Airlines Cancellation Policy:** - It’s essential for passengers to review the fare rules and terms and conditions associated with their tickets before canceling a flight. - Passengers uncertain about their travel plans may want to consider purchasing refundable tickets or travel insurance for added flexibility. **6. What Is Philippines Airlines Cancellation Policy for Basic Economy?** - Passengers holding Basic Economy tickets should carefully review the specific cancellation terms and conditions outlined by Philippines Airlines . - They should be aware of any applicable fees or restrictions before proceeding with flight cancellation. **7. Contact Philippines Airlines for Assistance:** - Passengers needing assistance with canceling their flights or clarifying the cancellation policy can reach out to Philippines Airlines ‘ customer service for personalized support and guidance. **Conclusion:** - Familiarizing yourself with Philippines Airlines cancellation policy and understanding the terms associated with your fare type can help you navigate changes to your travel plans effectively. - Stay informed about any updates or revisions to the cancellation policy to ensure a smooth and hassle-free travel experience. Safe travels!
    • This is the hidden content, please Sign In or Sign Up
  • Topics

×
×
  • Create New...